DooDoot wrote: ↑Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:41 am
Just as, with an assemblage of parts,
The word 'chariot' is used,
So, when the aggregates are present,
There's
the convention 'a being.'
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .bodh.html[/i]
It appears physical (rupa) "assumed" to be "a being" is unrelated to what "a being" actually is; as defined as in SN 5.10, namely, a mental assumption, view or convention. SN 12.2 says quite literally "jati" is the "bringing forth" of this & that "
beings (sattānaṃ)" into this & that "
groups of beings" ("sattanikāye").
So a "being" is what we call a living creature, but it is really just a set of aggregates, a collection of parts. But the nidana "definitions" below clearly describe the birth, aging and death of
living creatures, and not just the birth, ageing and death of a view or idea. These descriptions have a strong physical/biological component, and are clearly not just describing a mental process. How can be a view or idea be subject to "decrepitude, brokenness, graying, wrinkling, decline of life-force, weakening of the faculties...."?
You are attempting to isolate one aspect of birth, but this approach isn't credible because aging and death arise in dependence upon birth - it's all one process.
From SN12.2 ( repeated in MN9 ):
"Now what is aging and death? Whatever aging, decrepitude, brokenness, graying, wrinkling, decline of life-force, weakening of the faculties of the various beings in this or that group of beings, that is called aging. Whatever deceasing, passing away, breaking up, disappearance, dying, death, completion of time, break up of the aggregates, casting off of the body, interruption in the life faculty of the various beings in this or that group of beings, that is called death.
"And what is birth? Whatever birth, taking birth, descent, coming-to-be, coming-forth, appearance of aggregates, & acquisition of [sense] media of the various beings in this or that group of beings, that is called birth."
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
DooDoot wrote: ↑Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:41 am
The Pali words appear to be plural. The Pali words appear to not say: "
birth of a single being among the different beings".
Actually this plurality argues against the idea of DO as an individual mental experience.