If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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budo
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If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by budo » Sat Aug 04, 2018 6:23 am

Many times people I have spoken to in real life and on the internet use the excuse:

"Yeah but there were people who attained stream entry just by hearing the buddha talk"

Yeah, back then people were living around the same time and location as the buddha, they were getting 100% unfilitered, natural, organic, concentrated, undistorted orange juice, I mean, Dhamma.

Today, a few thousand years later, all we have is watered down/dilluted, sugary orange Fanta.

So you gotta produce your own juice from scratch, the same way the Buddha did on the night of his enlightenment, because you're not going to get stream entry from orange Fanta theory, you need to concentrate your own fresh orange juice with meditation. Otherwise you'll lose your teeth from all the addicting sugar in Fanta that tastes and looks good, but doesn't make you healthy.

SarathW
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by SarathW » Sat Aug 04, 2018 7:21 am

"Then there is the case where a monk takes the Dhamma as he has heard & studied it and thinks about it, evaluates it, and examines it with his intellect. He spends the day in Dhamma-thinking. He neglects seclusion. He doesn't commit himself to internal tranquillity of awareness. This is called a monk who is keen on thinking, not one who dwells in the Dhamma.

ttps://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an0 ... .than.html
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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budo
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by budo » Sat Aug 04, 2018 7:32 am

Yeah, the dhamma of ~2.5 thousand years ago, straight from the horses mouth, the ONE pure dhamma.

Not theravada, mahayana, vipassana, tibetian, zen, vajrayana, and all the many dilluted Fanta flavours of Dhamma we have today.

Ever heard of broken telephone?

The only one thing that's consistent and repeated thousands of times in suttas, dhammapada, theragatha, patisambhidhamagga, chinese agamas, and everywhere is meditation and jhanas, yet people refuse to sit down and meditate because it's not easy, and they're addicted to their current habits so they make excuses.

form
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by form » Sat Aug 04, 2018 7:46 am

Budo, what u said is so true.

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DooDoot
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by DooDoot » Sat Aug 04, 2018 9:20 am

I think a "person" pushing "others" to practise like a Hindu guru is straying away from the path & not getting anywhere. Stuck in the world of self.

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cappuccino
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by cappuccino » Sat Aug 04, 2018 10:57 am

the teaching is pristine water in a desert, and you're dying of thirst as you mock

meanwhile some are saved by this oasis
“Life is anxiety”

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DooDoot
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by DooDoot » Sat Aug 04, 2018 11:44 am

the teaching is also like a compass in a forest, and you're lost in hallucinations believing every tree is the enlightened self

meanwhile some that find their way thru the forest of delusive hallucinations are saved by this compass

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_anicca_
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by _anicca_ » Sat Aug 04, 2018 6:58 pm

Lay people practice more vigorously (in the West) than they used to as well, so if you combine this with theory then attainments are possible.

However, some people do attain sotapatti just from theory and that is because they have kusala kamma from past actions.
"A virtuous monk, Kotthita my friend, should attend in an appropriate way to the five clinging-aggregates as inconstant, stressful, a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction, alien, a dissolution, an emptiness, not-self."

:buddha1:

http://vipassanameditation.asia

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mikenz66
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by mikenz66 » Sat Aug 04, 2018 9:57 pm

Comparisons with other paths moved here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=32528&p=483124

:heart:

justindesilva
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by justindesilva » Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:59 am

mikenz66 wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 9:57 pm
Comparisons with other paths moved here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=32528&p=483124

:heart:
Theory in anything is important. For me in understsnding budda darma , I stopped at Paticca samuppada , and started again with 12 nidanas , as theory to understand what budda taught. The theory of 12 nidanas can be grasped by reading various suttas .
( I have come to know that paticca ssmuppada is the context of 84 suttas ).

markandeya
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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by markandeya » Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:05 am

There is no problem with the written texts, the main problem as I see it is the mode of education that is applied to the texts.

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Re: If you think you're going to get anywhere with theory

Post by retrofuturist » Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:46 pm

Greetings,
Anguttara Nikaya 10:121 wrote:Bhikkhus, just as the dawn is the forerunner and first indication of the rising of the sun, so is right view the forerunner and first indication of wholesome states.

For one of right view, bhikkhus, right intention springs up. For one of right intention, right speech springs up. For one of right speech, right action springs up. For one of right action, right livelihood springs up. For one of right livelihood, right effort springs up. For one of right effort, right mindfulness springs up. For one of right mindfulness, right concentration springs up. For one of right concentration, right knowledge springs up. For one of right knowledge, right deliverance springs up.
Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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