Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
SarathW
Posts: 21305
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by SarathW »

Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

=======
The Buddha educated, encouraged, fired up, and inspired her with a Dhamma talk. Then she said to the Buddha: “Sir, may the Buddha together with the mendicant Saṅgha please accept tomorrow’s meal from me.” The Buddha consented in silence. Then, knowing that the Buddha had accepted, Ambapālī got up from her seat, bowed, and respectfully circled the Buddha, keeping him on her right, before leaving.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
User1249x
Posts: 2749
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:50 pm

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by User1249x »

If i was going to guess i would say that because there is no question there is no need to say anything.
User avatar
DooDoot
Posts: 12032
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:06 pm

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by DooDoot »

SarathW wrote: Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:54 am Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?
Imo, because Ambapālī might think she seduced Buddha with lust. Buddha either says "No" or a "silent yes". It means Buddha is not controlled by others.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
SarathW
Posts: 21305
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by SarathW »

Ambapālī might think she seduced Buddha with lus
You mean lust for food?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
User avatar
Sam Vara
Site Admin
Posts: 13582
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2011 5:42 pm
Location: Portsmouth, U.K.

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by Sam Vara »

That's a really interesting question. I've often seen it in the suttas, but never the origin, or an explanation.

It might be just the custom of the time; that when offered something, one automatically accepts and one has a responsibility to say something only if one refuses. If so, I find it quite appealing that a culture should treat giving and helping as something normal and taken for granted.

DooDoot's answer seems very plausible, though. It is related to monks not thanking supporters according to Western customs. If the Buddha gave acceptance speeches, people would probably get into a competition to see who could elicit the most superlatives from him. Rivalry would soon set in, and people would get unhappy that their acceptance by the Buddha was not as "good" as their neighbour's.
justindesilva
Posts: 2607
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:38 pm

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by justindesilva »

SarathW wrote: Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:54 am Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

=======
The Buddha educated, encouraged, fired up, and inspired her with a Dhamma talk. Then she said to the Buddha: “Sir, may the Buddha together with the mendicant Saṅgha please accept tomorrow’s meal from me.” The Buddha consented in silence. Then, knowing that the Buddha had accepted, Ambapālī got up from her seat, bowed, and respectfully circled the Buddha, keeping him on her right, before leaving.
This post says " then , knowing that the budda had accepted" !
What more. Lord Budda never used words, more than necessary. It is aryan.
Ruud
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 9:07 am

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by Ruud »

In addition to the above, as another example that silence is understood as yes, the following from the Pātimokkha:
Venerable sirs, the ninety-two rules entailing expiation have been recited.
Herein I ask the venerable ones: Are you pure in this?
For a second time I ask the venerable ones: Are you pure in this?
For a third time I ask the venerable ones: Are you pure in this?
The venerable ones are pure herein; that is why they are silent. So I record it
(transl.:Ven.Ñānamoli)
Dry up what pertains to the past,
do not take up anything to come later.
If you will not grasp in the middle,
you will live at peace.
—Snp.5.11,v.1099 (tr. Ven. Bhikkhu Bodhi)

Whatever is will be was. —Ven. Ñānamoli, A Thinkers Notebook, §221
User avatar
diligence
Posts: 66
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:21 am
Location: China

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by diligence »

SarathW wrote: Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:54 am Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?
Why? Why on earth Buddha agreed by silence? Is it just because of the custom of the time as Sam Vara said? :thinking:
With the arising of delight, there is the arising of suffering. With the cessation of delight, comes the cessation of suffering.
Nandisamudayā dukkhasamudayo, nandinirodhā dukkhanirodho.
Dukkhameva uppajjamānaṃ uppajjati, dukkhaṃ nirujjhamānaṃ nirujjhati.
User avatar
seeker242
Posts: 1114
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:01 am

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by seeker242 »

“Why can’t he” doesn’t make any sense because there is nothing to indicate that he can’t.
User avatar
Sam Vara
Site Admin
Posts: 13582
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2011 5:42 pm
Location: Portsmouth, U.K.

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by Sam Vara »

seeker242 wrote: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:42 am “Why can’t he” doesn’t make any sense because there is nothing to indicate that he can’t.
I think, making due allowances for non-native English speakers and how people have chosen to answer the question, we might also read it as "Why doesn't he".
User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 6512
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Location: Mae Wang Huai Rin, Li District, Lamphun

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by Dhammanando »

SarathW wrote: Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:54 am Why Buddha can’t tell "yes I will"?

=======
The Buddha educated, encouraged, fired up, and inspired her with a Dhamma talk. Then she said to the Buddha: “Sir, may the Buddha together with the mendicant Saṅgha please accept tomorrow’s meal from me.” The Buddha consented in silence. Then, knowing that the Buddha had accepted, Ambapālī got up from her seat, bowed, and respectfully circled the Buddha, keeping him on her right, before leaving.
The commentarial glosses on the phrase, “The Blessed One consented by remaining silent” (adhivāsesi bhagavā tuṇhībhāvena) limit themselves to explaining the meaning of the phrase: he consented in mind only, not with body or speech. They don’t explain why he chose to consent in this particular way.

I suspect it was just a convention of the time, considering that (1) the commentaries don’t see it as something that needs explaining, and (2) the practice wasn’t unique to the Buddha, for we find his disciples reported doing the same thing, both good ones like Anuruddha and bad ones like Sudinna Kalandaputta.

DooDoot wrote: Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:17 am Imo, because Ambapālī might think she seduced Buddha with lust. Buddha either says "No" or a "silent yes". It means Buddha is not controlled by others.
What’s described in the quoted sutta is the Buddha’s only way of responding affirmatively to the fifty or so invitations he gets in the Sutta and Vinaya Piṭakas. The same response is used regardless of the sex of the inviter, most of whom are male.
Yena yena hi maññanti,
tato taṃ hoti aññathā.


In whatever way they conceive it,
It turns out otherwise.
(Sn. 588)
Bundokji
Posts: 6507
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:57 pm

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by Bundokji »

There is a lot of repetition in the Suttas. For example, when people come to the Buddha, they bow to him, sit beside him, exchange friendly greetings ....etc

The point, as I see it, is a unified style of story telling. I would not draw any conclusions about the Buddha based on them .
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.
SarathW
Posts: 21305
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by SarathW »

I suspect it was just a convention of the time
We have a custom ins Sri Lanka that people do not commit for the future because future is uncertain.
When I was young we never ask the driver the time for destination because they get angry since the road conditions and the reliability of the vehicle is so bad.
Some people say yes to future commitments with the addition "god willing".
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
User avatar
diligence
Posts: 66
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:21 am
Location: China

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by diligence »

Dhammanando wrote: Wed Jul 25, 2018 6:15 pm
The commentarial glosses on the phrase, “The Blessed One consented by remaining silent” (adhivāsesi bhagavā tuṇhībhāvena) limit themselves to explaining the meaning of the phrase: he consented in mind only, not with body or speech. They don’t explain why he chose to consent in this particular way.

I suspect it was just a convention of the time, considering that (1) the commentaries don’t see it as something that needs explaining, and (2) the practice wasn’t unique to the Buddha, for we find his disciples reported doing the same thing, both good ones like Anuruddha and bad ones like Sudinna Kalandaputta.

What’s described in the quoted sutta is the Buddha’s only way of responding affirmatively to the fifty or so invitations he gets in the Sutta and Vinaya Piṭakas. The same response is used regardless of the sex of the inviter, most of whom are male.

Thank you very much, bhante! :anjali: I see now.
With the arising of delight, there is the arising of suffering. With the cessation of delight, comes the cessation of suffering.
Nandisamudayā dukkhasamudayo, nandinirodhā dukkhanirodho.
Dukkhameva uppajjamānaṃ uppajjati, dukkhaṃ nirujjhamānaṃ nirujjhati.
User avatar
diligence
Posts: 66
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:21 am
Location: China

Re: Why Buddha can't tell "yes I will"?

Post by diligence »

Sam Vara wrote: Wed Jul 25, 2018 11:11 am I think, making due allowances for non-native English speakers and how people have chosen to answer the question, we might also read it as "Why doesn't he".
Thanks a lot for your understanding and considerate. I am a non-native English speaker and each time I use online dictionary to read and write in English. However, I also try to improve my English. :smile:
With the arising of delight, there is the arising of suffering. With the cessation of delight, comes the cessation of suffering.
Nandisamudayā dukkhasamudayo, nandinirodhā dukkhanirodho.
Dukkhameva uppajjamānaṃ uppajjati, dukkhaṃ nirujjhamānaṃ nirujjhati.
Post Reply