Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

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Dinsdale
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by Dinsdale » Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:36 am

Saengnapha wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:05 am
U.G. said many times that each person that comes into this natural state will be necessarily unique in their expression of it. They will also affect the consciousness of all beings in ways we can't understand.
It seems like you are trying to interpret Buddhist teachings through a UG lens - that is bound to be tricky!
Buddha save me from new-agers!

chownah
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by chownah » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:03 pm

Dinsdale wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:36 am
Saengnapha wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:05 am
U.G. said many times that each person that comes into this natural state will be necessarily unique in their expression of it. They will also affect the consciousness of all beings in ways we can't understand.
It seems like you are trying to interpret Buddhist teachings through a UG lens - that is bound to be tricky!
....and probably belongs in the Connections to other Paths forum.
chownah

Saengnapha
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by Saengnapha » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:42 pm

Dinsdale wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:36 am
Saengnapha wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:05 am
U.G. said many times that each person that comes into this natural state will be necessarily unique in their expression of it. They will also affect the consciousness of all beings in ways we can't understand.
It seems like you are trying to interpret Buddhist teachings through a UG lens - that is bound to be tricky!
It's the same as you would do through a Buddhist lens. But, I already know that because of the terminology and the differences in the cultures of 2500 years ago, backgrounds of individuals who been awakened at various times in history, etc., they will never match. That really doesn't bother me. But there are similarities that I've found, especially in the way that Bhante P talks about the Buddhist process and his commentaries on suttas, etc. Not everyone is going to rally around one teacher, but for most people, having one teacher is extremely beneficial, especially an awakened one. I'm not even sure that many of the posters here have ever had a close relationship with a teacher face to face. For all I know, most of this might be simply from reading or listening to youtube or such things.

Saengnapha
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by Saengnapha » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:46 pm

chownah wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:03 pm
Dinsdale wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:36 am
Saengnapha wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:05 am
U.G. said many times that each person that comes into this natural state will be necessarily unique in their expression of it. They will also affect the consciousness of all beings in ways we can't understand.
It seems like you are trying to interpret Buddhist teachings through a UG lens - that is bound to be tricky!
....and probably belongs in the Connections to other Paths forum.
chownah
Do you have personal objections to me commenting on U.G. outside of the 'Connections To Other Paths' forum? If so, I can refrain, especially if the mods don't approve. I haven't heard anything from the mods at all about not posting here.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:08 pm

Greetings Saengnapha,
Saengnapha wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:46 pm
Do you have personal objections to me commenting on U.G. outside of the 'Connections To Other Paths' forum? If so, I can refrain, especially if the mods don't approve. I haven't heard anything from the mods at all about not posting here.
It is off-topic and not relevant to a General Theravada discussion, so Chownah is correct.

Metta,
Paul. :)
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"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

SarathW
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by SarathW » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:28 am

Perhaps Namarupa could be a state between pure Nama and Pure Rupa.
:shrug:
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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mikenz66
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by mikenz66 » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:07 am

SarathW wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:28 am
Perhaps Namarupa could be a state between pure Nama and Pure Rupa.
:shrug:
I don't understand what you are getting at. What do you mean by a "state" ?

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rightviewftw
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by rightviewftw » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:18 am

Nama&Rupa = Aggregates = Rupa/Arupa Existence gaining footing int the Deathless. :popcorn:
Nama&Rupa = Impermanent, Possible
Deathless = Uncaused, Non-Impermanent, Possible
Here a clear statement for you Inviting refutation.

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SarathW
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by SarathW » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:55 am

What do you mean by a "state" ?
I did not mean Gandhabba here.
I just wonder whether there is an intermediate thing between Nama and Rupa.
ie: You cant say it is Nama or Rupa. It is a combination of both.
This is just another view.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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DooDoot
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by DooDoot » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:40 pm

rightviewftw wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:18 am
Nama&Rupa = Aggregates
If nama-rupa = aggregates then the Buddha would have called the 4th link aggregates. But the Buddha obviously did not do this.

James Tan
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by James Tan » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:33 am

SarathW wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:28 am
Perhaps Namarupa could be a state between pure Nama and Pure Rupa.
:shrug:
Hi sarath ,

Unfortunately , you could not get your answer from sc forum , so you try to find out here . The scholars and sophisticated poster there unable to give you a definite answer so is here . This is a myth for over thousands years .
Only a handful of people has the answer .

James Tan
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by James Tan » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:35 am

DooDoot wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:40 pm
rightviewftw wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:18 am
Nama&Rupa = Aggregates
If nama-rupa = aggregates then the Buddha would have called the 4th link aggregates. But the Buddha obviously did not do this.
Agree , however , you can't give an answer , do you ?

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DooDoot
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by DooDoot » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:55 am

James Tan wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:35 am
Agree , however , you can't give an answer , do you ?
Thanks James. I recall making many posts on this thread. I proposed 'nama-rupa' refers to 'inclinations' of the 'mind-body'.

James Tan
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by James Tan » Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:55 am

DooDoot wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:55 am
James Tan wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:35 am
Agree , however , you can't give an answer , do you ?
Thanks James. I recall making many posts on this thread. I proposed 'nama-rupa' refers to 'inclinations' of the 'mind-body'.
Ok , but how do you relate it in the dependent origination and dependent cessation to consciousness and six senses base ?

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DooDoot
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Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Post by DooDoot » Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:51 am

James Tan wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:55 am
Ok , but how do you relate it in the dependent origination and dependent cessation to consciousness and six senses base ?
'Inclination' of 'mind-body' arises due to ignorance & the sankharas. Consciousness will also simultaneously arise & be enslaved by ignorance & sankharas in this process. When the mind-body incline (such as are affected by sensual desire), the sense organs will incline to seek out sense objects externally.

For example, you try to meditate but ignorance attacks your mind-body with sankharas of sensual desire. So you stop meditating & the sense organs look for sense objects on the internet to gain sensual pleasure from.

But if the mind-body has mindfulness, instead of stimulating the external sense bases, mindfulness of the mind-body will calm the sankharas, attain samadhi, and, with vipassana, destroy ignorance; which is dependent cessation.

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