What are views?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
SarathW
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What are views?

Post by SarathW » Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:20 pm

What are views?

I like someone to tell me what is meant by view.
a)Are views latent factor. What are they?
b)Are newly born children have views?
c)How we develop new views? What are they?
d)Are Arahants got views?
e)Can we live without views?
f) Are all views bad?
g) What is the life like without views?
h)What is the etymology of Ditthi?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

paul
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Re: What are views?

Post by paul » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:28 am

“Our views might not be clearly formulated in our mind; we might have only a hazy conceptual grasp of our beliefs. But whether formulated or not, expressed or maintained in silence, these views have a far-reaching influence. They structure our perceptions, order our values, crystallize into the ideational framework through which we interpret to ourselves the meaning of our being in the world.” —“The Noble Eightfold Path”, Bikkhu Bodhi.

"Of the perversions, the following are eliminated by the 1st path-knowledge (sotápatti): the perversions of perception, consciousness and views, that the impermanent is permanent and what is not a self is a self; further, the perversion of views that the painful is pleasant, and the impure is pure. By the 3rd path-knowledge (anágámitá) are eliminated: the perversions of perception and consciousness that the impure is pure. By the 4th path-knowledge (arahatta) are eliminated the perversions of perception and consciousness that the painful is pleasant" (Vis.M. XXII, 68).

It can be seen that the elimination of wrong views precedes that of perception and consciousness because both can arise from views.
Last edited by paul on Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

SarathW
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Re: What are views?

Post by SarathW » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:23 am

Thank you Paul.
Can I say that any perception and feeling experience by five aggregate is views?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

chownah
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Re: What are views?

Post by chownah » Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:07 pm

YOu can say that but I think you would be wrong. If you want to see what a view is a good place to start is by studying all the sutta references to right and wrong view.....that should give you a ball park idea about what views are.
chownah

SarathW
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Re: What are views?

Post by SarathW » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:48 pm

Agree
But I need some basic guideline so I can decide what are wrong views.
For example wishing some one a happy new year or happy birthday could be a view.
Perhaps that could be a view result of ignorance or customs.
So Buddha (a monk) may not give someone a birth day greeting.
Perhaps there could be wrong view, right view or neutral views.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

santa100
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Re: What are views?

Post by santa100 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:17 pm

Definitions and sutta references on right/wrong views available here

SarathW
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Re: What are views?

Post by SarathW » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:59 pm

Thanks Santa
The question I have is are there other views not come under the category of right and wrong.

What are they?

What is the basic rule of thumb for right and wrong view?
If any thing not leading to the final goal is wrong view?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

santa100
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Re: What are views?

Post by santa100 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 1:57 am

SarathW wrote:The question I have is are there other views not come under the category of right and wrong.
I think at least at our level, the level of un-enlightened worldlings, there'd be only right or wrong views. And it's wrong views more often than right view for we have all kinds of self-identity views from coarsest to subtlest levels. It's only after one has attained Stream-Entry would identity-view/SakkayaDitthi be completedly abandoned.
What is the basic rule of thumb for right and wrong view?
If any thing not leading to the final goal is wrong view?
Answers already provided in previous post.

SarathW
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Re: What are views?

Post by SarathW » Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:02 am

Are thoughts, this is my mother, father, country etc wrong view or right view?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

santa100
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Re: What are views?

Post by santa100 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:14 am

But those sound more like perception/Sanna rather than view/Ditthi, where one'd need to establish some kind of "position" after the perception. Example: "This is my mother" (Sanna); "It's important to take care of my mother" (Ditthi)

chownah
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Re: What are views?

Post by chownah » Sun Jan 01, 2017 3:47 am

You might try thinking of views as being opinions.
chownah

paul
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Re: What are views?

Post by paul » Mon Jan 02, 2017 1:07 pm

"Mundane right view involves a correct grasp of the law of kamma, the moral efficacy of action. Its literal name is "right view of the ownership of action" (kammassakata sammaditthi), and it finds its standard formulation in the statement: "Beings are the owners of their actions, the heirs of their actions; they spring from their actions, are bound to their actions, and are supported by their actions. Whatever deeds they do, good or bad, of those they shall be heirs." More specific formulations have also come down in the texts. One stock passage, for example, affirms that virtuous actions such as giving and offering alms have moral significance, that good and bad deeds produce corresponding fruits, that one has a duty to serve mother and father, that there is rebirth and a world beyond the visible one, and that religious teachers of high attainment can be found who expound the truth about the world on the basis of their own superior realization."--"The Noble Eightfold Path", Bikkhu Bodhi.

Although it is called mundane right view, an understanding of the action of the law of kamma already signifies a shift away from reliance on self because self gratification as a prime motive is replaced.
Right view not of the world, conjoined with the path, is understanding of the Four Noble Truths either individually or as a whole, suffering, its origin, its cessation and the path leading to that cessation.
Last edited by paul on Wed Jan 04, 2017 11:59 am, edited 3 times in total.

SarathW
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Re: What are views?

Post by SarathW » Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:30 pm

santa100 wrote:But those sound more like perception/Sanna rather than view/Ditthi, where one'd need to establish some kind of "position" after the perception. Example: "This is my mother" (Sanna); "It's important to take care of my mother" (Ditthi)
How about if I take care of my mother with compassion?
Is compassion considered Ditthi?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

santa100
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Re: What are views?

Post by santa100 » Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:02 am

SarathW wrote:How about if I take care of my mother with compassion?
That's a wholesome ditthi to start out with. Notice the highlighted words and see the limitation of having them. How about other people's mothers? How about your enemies' mothers? Do you take care of them with compassion? So eventually, self view will need to go in order for compassion to grow and reach the level of the brahmaviharas.

SarathW
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Re: What are views?

Post by SarathW » Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:31 am

Good point.
Is compassion considered Ditthi?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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