The causes for wisdom

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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Virgo
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Virgo »

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Ben
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Ben »

Virgo wrote:This is a good related talk:

http://www.dhammastudygroup.org/audio/2 ... m-b-01.mp3
Related to what, exactly, Kevin?
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Mr Man
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Mr Man »

Hi Virgo
Perhaps you could bring what you took from the talk to the discusion?
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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by tiltbillings »

Mr Man wrote:Hi Virgo
Perhaps you could bring what you took from the talk to the discusion?
Did you listen to it?
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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Mr Man
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Mr Man »

tiltbillings wrote:
Mr Man wrote:Hi Virgo
Perhaps you could bring what you took from the talk to the discusion?
Did you listen to it?
Yes I did. I think that it would be nice for Virgo to say how he relates the clip to this discusion though.
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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by tiltbillings »

Mr Man wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:
Mr Man wrote:Hi Virgo
Perhaps you could bring what you took from the talk to the discusion?
Did you listen to it?
Yes I did. I think that it would be nice for Virgo to say how he relates the clip to this discusion though.
I hope he does. One needs to do more than just plop something on the table without being willing to discuss it. While the characterization of traditional metta meditation is in line with some things said in this thread, it would be of interest to read a what Sujin followers have to about what is said in the talk.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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Virgo
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Re: The causes for wisdom

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Ben wrote:
Virgo wrote:This is a good related talk:

http://www.dhammastudygroup.org/audio/2 ... m-b-01.mp3
Related to what, exactly, Kevin?
The right path and the wrong path.

Kevin
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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by tiltbillings »

Virgo wrote:
Ben wrote:
Virgo wrote:This is a good related talk:

http://www.dhammastudygroup.org/audio/2 ... m-b-01.mp3
Related to what, exactly, Kevin?
The right path and the wrong path.

Kevin
Don't be stingy with your words. What is the right path and what is the wrong path?
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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Virgo
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Virgo »

Mr Man wrote:Hi Virgo
Perhaps you could bring what you took from the talk to the discusion?
Very often we take akusala for kusala. Is there really calm or is it attachment? This is evident in the discussion about metta practice in the talk.

We have so much lobha that we don't even recognize it most of the time. Is that really renunciation? Or is that just developing more subtle akusala?

These are the questions we have to ask ourselves.

Kevin
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Virgo
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Virgo »

tiltbillings wrote: Don't be stingy with your words. What is the right path and what is the wrong path?
One needs to understand magga-paccaya to really understand it.

Kevin
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Mr Man
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Mr Man »

Virgo wrote:
tiltbillings wrote: Don't be stingy with your words. What is the right path and what is the wrong path?
One needs to understand magga-paccaya to really understand it.

Kevin
Virgo
Do you understand it?
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Mr Man
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Mr Man »

Virgo wrote:
Mr Man wrote:Hi Virgo
Perhaps you could bring what you took from the talk to the discusion?
Very often we take akusala for kusala. Is there really calm or is it attachment? This is evident in the discussion about metta practice in the talk.

We have so much lobha that we don't even recognize it most of the time. Is that really renunciation? Or is that just developing more subtle akusala?

These are the questions we have to ask ourselves.

Kevin
Virgo
And do you know kusala and akusala? Do you know lobha? Are you possibly just passing on someone else's view? Do you see the attachment you have?
Where are you Virgo? Can you work with that?
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Virgo
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Re: The causes for wisdom

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Mr Man wrote:
Virgo wrote:
tiltbillings wrote: Don't be stingy with your words. What is the right path and what is the wrong path?
One needs to understand magga-paccaya to really understand it.

Kevin
Virgo
Do you understand it?
I like to think that I understand it fairly well, yes.

Kevin
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Mr Man
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by Mr Man »

Virgo wrote:
Mr Man wrote:

Virgo
Do you understand it?
I like to think that I understand it fairly well, yes.

Kevin
So Virgo, You know what is right path and what is wrong path? You know you are on the right path (you have gone beyond doubt)? And you no when others are on the wrong path?
Last edited by Mr Man on Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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kirk5a
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Post by kirk5a »

I am finding it interesting to learn about the Abhidhammic way of looking at things. So when I searched ATI for "magga-paccaya" I also found this in The Abhidhamma in Practice, by N.K.G. Mendis, in a list of "paccayas" (Modes of Conditioning)
Faculty condition (indriya paccaya). There are twenty-two faculties: six sense bases, two sexes, the life faculty, five feelings, five feelings, five spiritual faculties, and three supra-mundane faculties. Except for the two sexes, the other twenty can exercise control in their respective spheres on the co-existent mental states and the material phenomena they originate. For example, mindfulness — one of the five spiritual faculties — has a controlling influence on the other four co-adjuncts during meditation.
and also this:
Free Will. Someone might say: "If all phenomena are conditionally arisen, then Buddhism is a form of fatalism, for we have no free will to control our destiny." Such a statement would not be correct. Will is volition (cetanaa), a mental state, determined ethically by its root condition (hetu paccaya). If the root is unwholesome, we can either restrain or indulge the volition; if the root is wholesome, we can encourage it or neglect it. In this exercise of will lies our freedom to guide our destiny.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... el322.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230
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