Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

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Hanzze
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Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:01 am

For sure a topic that might raise many controverses.

In traditional countries, the celerbrating of birthday was as good as unknown. If we discover the teachings of the Buddha a little, its not difficult why people did not celerbrate it at all.
Now that is a total differnt situation to our modern times as well as a dramatic change through modern times influences in the traditional countries.

Would a serious praticing Buddhist celerbrate Birthday?

As a warm-up maybe a similie from Ajhan Chah:
The Beginning Is the End

When we're born we're already dead, you know. Aging and death are the same thing. It's like a tree. Part of it's the base; part of it's the end at the tip. When there's a base, there's an end. When there's an end, there's a base. When there's no base, there's no end. When there's an end, there has to be a base. An end without a base: That can't be. That's how it is.

So it's kind of amusing. When a person dies, we're sad and upset. We sit and cry, grieving — all kinds of things. That's delusion. It's delusion, you know. When a person dies we sob and cry. That's the way it's been since who knows when. We don't stop to examine this carefully. Actually — and excuse me for saying this — it appears to me that if you're going to cry when a person dies, it'd be better to cry when a person is born. But we have it all backwards. When a child is born, people beam and laugh from happiness. But actually birth is death. Death is birth. The beginning is the end; the end is the beginning.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ben
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:14 am

Hanzze wrote:Would a serious praticing Buddhist celerbrate Birthday?
Why not?
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

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Hanzze
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:17 am

The first word that comes to my mind was: perverse (contrariwise)

Somehow it is as perverse for our normal understanding to celerbrate death.
Last edited by Hanzze on Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ben
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:18 am

ok, but what's the big deal about celebrating (or not celebrating) birthdays?
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

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Hanzze
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:27 am

That's a good question, that even carries the answer.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ben
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:29 am

Hanzze wrote:That's a good question, that even carries the answer.
Well, I'm glad we got that one sorted.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

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Hanzze
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:57 pm

Can you explain what you mean by sorted?
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ben
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:05 pm

Yes.
In this context it means 'resolved'.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

User avatar
Hanzze
Posts: 1906
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Location: Cambodia

Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:08 pm

Great. Let us keep silent. ;)
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Ben
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Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:11 pm

No, I would prefer you tell me why you have a problem with celebrating birthdays.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

User avatar
Hanzze
Posts: 1906
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Location: Cambodia

Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:17 pm

Nothing, as long as it is does not generate to a Buddhist tradition. Although, that is also not a big deal.

Let me ask you why it is a big deal for you to know why it would be maybe a big deal with a problem with celebrating birthdays?
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

User avatar
Ben
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Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: kanamaluka

Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:20 pm

Hanzze,

You asked the question:
Would a serious praticing Buddhist celerbrate Birthday?
And I asked in response:
Why not?
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

User avatar
Hanzze
Posts: 1906
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Cambodia

Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:24 pm

I guess to answer this would just be a rebirth of the previous post. So we can say, the first birthday. Let us celerbrate. :candle:

Do you find that this makes sence? Or is it somehow irritating to celerbrate such a happening?
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

User avatar
Ben
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Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: kanamaluka

Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Ben » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:29 pm

Do you find your birthday celebrations irritating, Hanzze?
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

User avatar
Hanzze
Posts: 1906
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Cambodia

Re: Birthday the atta/jati celerbration

Post by Hanzze » Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:51 pm

To celebrate* birthday is somehow allways iritating ("exciting, provoking"). In case of jati-worship or atta-worship and Dhamma the word "provoking" seems to be the most appropriate.

* 1. to observe (a day) or commemorate (an event) with ceremonies or festivities
2. to make known publicly; proclaim
3. to praise widely or to present to widespread and favorable public notice, as through newspapers or novels.
4. to perform with appropriate rites and ceremonies


What about addoting this common tradition/ceremony and give it a new color? Maybe a kind of Jati-remember-day, a kind of special meditative day. Or would that be to much iritating?
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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