Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
Mawkish1983
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Mawkish1983 » Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:45 am

Regardless of the facts (or otherwise), the media reporting does affect the western public perception of Myanmar and Buddhism. Some of my friends smuggly present at these news reports as evidence that 'Buddhism is just another religion' and to show that 'all religions cause war'; or words to that effect. I try not to engage in those types of discussions because I don't know the facts and any defense of Buddhism would seemingly be driven from pride in the path I've chosen. Again, the facts become hidden by the effect of third party perception.

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imagemarie
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by imagemarie » Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:05 am

Ben wrote:question everything and follow the evidence.
Is right I think. And I thank drifting cloud for raising the topic. I have, as a result, been doing my own researches on the internet.
but what good is there in condemning the monks, the Burmese, the Muslims, or the ethnic groups involved? It is a complicated issue
No good at all. But we can seek to understand, as much as possible, our own reactions to events that are reported, and to see where WE are invested.

:anjali:

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SDC
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by SDC » Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:35 pm

drifting cloud wrote:I am a little disappointed that this thread has garnered so little interest
You should be happy. Chalk up the lack of interest to people not seeing this issue as anymore important than any other just because it involves Buddhism.

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Dmytro
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Dmytro » Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:46 am

A credible view from inside:

88 Generation Leaders Speak Out on Rohingya Issue

http://www.irrawaddy.org/archives/11004" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Dmytro
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Dmytro » Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:05 am

An article from independent source:

How big is the Rohingya uprising?

http://www.facebook.com/notes/may-thing ... 7478288810" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(also at http://moemaka.org/index.php?option=com ... Itemid=309" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )

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Kim OHara
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Kim OHara » Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:58 am

Thanks for those links, Dmytro.
No references to Buddhist monks participating in any of the unrest there.
:juggling:

Kim

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Dmytro
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Dmytro » Thu Aug 09, 2012 6:33 am

I lived for a long time in a big country which enthusiastically fought for freedom of oppressed people worldwide.
There were daily stories of minority heroes struggling against the unjust persecution abroad.
Schoolchildren wrote compositions in support of regime victims, and collected humanitarian aid to send abroad.
Newspapers mourned the poor people abroad, suffering from exploitation.

Actually, these were the crocodile's tears - the Soviet Union, under the guise of fighting for freedom, supported the subversive and terrorist groups worldwide.
Now this country is gone for good.

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Mr Man
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Mr Man » Thu Aug 09, 2012 8:57 am

Dmytro, so do you think that there is no reason for concern with how Rohingya are treated in Myanmar?


An article from independent source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-p ... 872635.stm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Dmytro
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Dmytro » Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:18 am

Mr Man wrote:Dmytro, so do you think that there is no reason for concern with how Rohingya are treated in Myanmar?
Mr Man, the problem is wider. The immigrants from Bangladesh won't come to Myanmar, Thailand and Malaysia if the conditions in Bangladesh weren't even worse.
Myanmar, Thailand and Malaysia won't grant them citizenship, so they are left without place to live.

Now that the climate change brought extensive flooding to Bangladesh, this exasperates the Bangladesh extreme conditions.
The climate change will bring a big northward wave of immigration worldwide.

Imagine for a moment a big wave of immigrants from South Africa settling in Greece, Italy and Spain, not assimilating culturally, and demanding their own autonomy.
Or a wave of Mexican immigrants oversweeping the border due to Mexican desertification.
This would also cause ethnical clashes.

Rohingya region is somewhat like Kosovo - there's no easy solution which would preserve the delicately balanced multinational integrity of Myanmar.

Surely there are grave reasons for concern. There's an urgent need for people who would be able to comprehend the entire situation and help to solve it without blaming and accusations. Perhaps UN would be helpful in this regard.

Even BBC, unfortunately, presents a biased view.

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Mr Man
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Mr Man » Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:18 am

Dmytro, The Rohingya have generaly been settled in Myanmar for many decades. They, for the most, are not recent imigrants from Bangladesh they are not bengali. Myanmar it their home and they deserve to be recognised as a distinct ethnic group within that country.

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Dmytro
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Dmytro » Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:37 am

Mr Man wrote:Dmytro, The Rohingya have generaly been settled in Myanmar for many decades. They, for the most, are not recent imigrants from Bangladesh they are not bengali.
Historically, they are recent immigrants, though indeed the new generation has been born in Myanmar.
Myanmar it their home and they deserve to be recognised as a distinct ethnic group within that country.
Their demands are more extensive:

"Rohingya demands the followings:

To give them nationality status and regard as an ethnicity;
To announce Buthi Tong and Maung Taw as Rohingya National Home;
To give them 40% control of the state government.

In fact, their demands are just the enforcements of their decisions from the first conference. ACP stated the demands would be considered even though they cannot be given at the moment. However, both ALP and ACP had to accept their demands for the reason that they are very strong. The regional conference agreed.To impose Rohingya Party as the only organization of Muslims in Arakan State. To give them western parts of Maung Taw and Buthi Tong, Naung Chaung and upper parts of Naung Cahaung as their home land. And the chairman of the military committee of the united front must be from Rohingya."

http://www.facebook.com/notes/may-thing ... 7478288810" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Mr Man
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Mr Man » Fri Aug 10, 2012 8:25 am

Dmytro wrote:
Historically, they are recent immigrants, though indeed the new generation has been born in Myanmar.
It is more than one generation. I would imagine that vast majority of the Rohingya population were born in Myanmar.
Their demands are more extensive:

"Rohingya demands the followings:
These demands should not negate the, dare I say it, "rights" of the individual.

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Doshin
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Doshin » Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:18 am

drifting cloud wrote:I am a little disappointed that this thread has garnered so little interest - ...
No posts, does not conclude no interest. Personally I don't write, because I don't want to point fingers and accusing others of doing bad things.

I try to practice my right speech, by not grabbing the keyboard and display anger at somebody I don't know, in matters I don't have the needed insight into.

However I have much interest in the matter, and I'm almost out of salt.
drifting cloud wrote:... I had thought that orders of ordained monks advocating ethnic cleansing in Burma's Arakan State might have evoked some kind of reaction - I realize, of course, there are finer points of Pali translation to be endlessly debated without conclusion, but surely the posters here have some thoughts?
I find your sarcasm, to be a kind of anger. And by anger you don't achieve anything (good).

_/\_
Knowing about dhamma, does not imply knowing dhamma

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Dmytro
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Dmytro » Fri Aug 10, 2012 2:27 pm

Mr Man wrote:These demands should not negate the, dare I say it, "rights" of the individual.
IMHO, the Western concept of supremacy of individual rights is somewhat self-contradictory and utopian.
There's often a chasm between declarated rights and actual possibilities.
In practice, this concept leads to denial of usage of any type of force, then to crisis due to inaction, and then to even more forceful outcomes.
For example, multiculturalism has spectacularly failed in Europe, and now strict cultural laws are adopted.
In USA, president Obama regularly signs the list of Islamic fundamentalists to be killed in Pakistan.
Even if the individual rights concept has some advantages, there's no reason to impose it in the East (including Myanmar) by pressure.
I find more useful the concept of common good by Plato, especially since it is consonant with Buddha's teaching.

Mawkish1983
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Re: Rohingya Massacres, Theravada Complicity?

Post by Mawkish1983 » Fri Aug 10, 2012 3:03 pm

Dmytro wrote:multiculturalism has spectacularly failed in Europe
No it hasn't.

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