Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Casual discussion amongst spiritual friends.
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Polar Bear
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by Polar Bear » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:47 am

alan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:15 am
Yes of course I know that.
But still, there are things that need to be hated, unless you want to become a dull--minded nobody , who just sits around saying stuff that has no relation to reality.
It's actually perfectly possible to undertake actions that will help slow down or halt Trump's agenda without hating him or even getting angry. It is sufficient to understand that something is harmful and then do something to counteract that harm, no need for hate and anger, just understanding and good-willed, compassionate, mentally-balanced and equanimous action in line with that understanding.

What have you done, Alan, to work against Trump's agenda aside from huff and puff on internet forums? And with those other things that you may have done, is hate a necessary condition for you to engage in them?

Here's an example contrasting a sensible course of action from an extremely hate-filled one:

I really like nature and wildlife. Humans are the biggest threat to nature and wildlife. But I don't hate humans. Instead, I periodically donate money to provide education and contraception to women so that they produce fewer humans (and live better lives themselves), I donate to environmental and wildlife focused organizations, I sign petitions and vote on issues that help protect wildlife, and I try to do or not do certain things in order to lower my own impact on the natural world and wildlife.

In contrast, if I hated humans I might be angry all the time and flood my body with large amounts of unpleasant cortisol, and do something crazy, like get a phd in virology and then attempt to create a virus to wipeout and/or sterilize all humans, or some significant subset of them.

What sounds like a better life among the two scenarios above, becoming a constantly angry mad-scientist, or helping the natural world and humans while working to attain my own peace of mind?
"I don't envision a single thing that, when developed & cultivated, leads to such great benefit as the mind. The mind, when developed & cultivated, leads to great benefit."

"I don't envision a single thing that, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about such suffering & stress as the mind. The mind, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about suffering & stress."

alan
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by alan » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:48 am

Schiff/Hoelzle 2020. Make America Smart Again.
Last edited by alan on Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by retrofuturist » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:50 am

Greetings Alan,
alan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:48 am
Schiff/Hoelzle 2020
Flip the ticket and I'll buy one of your hats too.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by alan » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:52 am

Only 20 bucks, free shipping to my Aussie friends.

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DNS
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by DNS » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:55 am

alan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:48 am
Schiff/Hoelzle 2020. Make America Smart Again.
Adam Schiff?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Schiff

Nah, let's vote for the intelligent one this time: Harambe
The dead gorilla had 5% support in late July 2016 (ahead of Green Party nominee Jill Stein) and 2% in August 2016 (tied with Stein).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_o ... _biography

alan
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by alan » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:00 am

.
Last edited by alan on Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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DNS
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by DNS » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:06 am

As polarbear noted, having hate is not going to solve anything, if you don't want him reelected, then you can get involved in organizations and things looking to remove him from power and/or to find a suitable Dem candidate for 2020. There are a number of organizations callings for his impeachment, although I don't think any of them will be successful.

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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by alan » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:12 am

That is why I must run for President. Have all the qualifications, including not having any idea about being President. But, I do take some lovely beach photos. So.

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Mr Man
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by Mr Man » Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:24 am

Here are a couple of quotes which might be relivent -

Bhikkhus, the bhikkhu endowed with seven things is disliked, not condescending, is not revered and not developed, to the co-associates in the holy life. What seven?

Here, bhikkhus, the bhikkhu desires, gain, honour, praise, is shameless, without remorse, with evil desires and wrong view. Bhikkhus, the bhikkhu endowed with these seven things is disliked, is not condescending, is not revered and not developed, to the co-associates in the holy life.

http://awake.kiev.ua/dhamma/tipitaka/2S ... ggo-e.html


To loathe more evil and abstain from it, to refrain from intoxicants,[12] and to be steadfast in virtue — this is the greatest blessing.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .nara.html

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mikenz66
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by mikenz66 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:36 am

DNS wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:46 am
alan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:40 am
Yeah, All the Jews should not be angry, they should not be hateful. They should not fight back!
Better to just give in,
Right?
....
Martin Luther King, Jr.
MLK didn't give in. He achieved a lot without hating his opponents. Not hating bad stuff or bad people doesn't mean you can't work for change...

:heart:
Mike

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Crazy cloud
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by Crazy cloud » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:18 am

alan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:36 am
Friends, I hate bad things.
If you do not, please explain here.
Hate is a personal choice, and I've gotten tired of making this body lose its natural coolness just because "I" feel for using the energy for my own selfish reasoning. And if I start hating a chosen "thing", do I add or do I diminish to the collected amount of hate "going around"? ... As far as I can see, I only see it growing and getting harder and heavier here.

:smile:
If you didn't care
What happened to me
And I didn't care for you

We would zig-zag our way
Through the boredom and pain
Occasionally glancing up through the rain

Wondering which of the
Buggers to blame
And watching for pigs on the wing
- Roger Waters

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Bundokji
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by Bundokji » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:40 am

Is this a false dilemma? i either hate him or love him!
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.

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seeker242
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by seeker242 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:27 pm

Harboring hate for bad things is foolish because simply hating does nothing to actually stop bad things from happening. It's actually counterproductive to that end because it consumes energy that could otherwise be used in a productive manner, to effect some actual positive changes. Stomping around in your living room yelling "I hate that!" doesn't actually change anything.

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Zom
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by Zom » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:45 pm

"I hate to hate and I hate that" (c) :D

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Will
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Re: Is hatred always bad, if you hate what should be hated?

Post by Will » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:11 pm

alan wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:28 am
Why? If you do not hate him, you are God Dam Idiot.
Sounds like you may be developing a hatred of those who do not hate what you hate. Can you see where this leads you?

Old saying from China maybe... "One who lives to hunt & kill dragons will turn into & die as a dragon."
Wholesome virtuous behavior progressively leads to the foremost. -- AN 10.1

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