A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Casual discussion amongst spiritual friends.
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Mr Man
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Mr Man » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:08 am

pilgrim wrote:31,000 shares in under 3 days. Clearly it struck a chord that finally there is some honesty cutting thru the political correctness and denials.

http://www.jeraldinephneah.me/2015/11/s ... -isis.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I'm not sure if Singapore suffers from "political correctness and denials." The UK certainly doesn't. There are differing opinions though - many extreme (you just have to have a look at some of the videos produced and stuff you get on you tube/social media).

In my opinion, the term political correctness generally only gets used be right wingers to try and discredit opposing views and force opinion in a certain direction.

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kirk5a
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by kirk5a » Tue Nov 17, 2015 2:27 pm

pilgrim wrote:The world has to defeat ISIS ideology
The most basic problem of which is trying to achieve political goals with murder, right?
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230

Pinetree
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Pinetree » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:08 pm

From my limited knowledge, the cause behind terrorism is hate and greed.

So if it's going to be treated as a Muslim problem, that would be missing the point. Ok, so our Caliph has an Islamic doctorate. If he had a doctorate in physics he would be building a nuclear bomb.

And a physicist would post on facebook that we have a problem with physics. Yes, we do, it's called greed, anger and delusion.

Oh, and I don't mean to offend any physics aficionados, this was just random choice.

On the other hand, maybe Muslims have more insight and tools to deal with ISIS, but I have strong doubts.

If somebody will make another post, saying that they have ISIS figured out and have the solution to the problem, that would definitely spark my interest. But that doesn't seem to be the case yet.

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kirk5a
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by kirk5a » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:30 pm

Pinetree wrote:From my limited knowledge, the cause behind terrorism is hate and greed.
Can you define "terrorism" ? Who commits "terrorism"? Is it only Muslim groups?
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230

Pinetree
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Pinetree » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:43 pm

I'm talking specifically about the current topic, the Paris attacks, but I have left room to generalize to similar acts.

Not only terrorism, but war generally, even in tribal societies. It's an old issue. So I see no need for a definition.

Terrorism is just a strategy. The US go - we blow you up, the terrorists go - we blow us up.

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kirk5a
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by kirk5a » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:58 pm

Pinetree wrote:I'm talking specifically about the current topic, the Paris attacks, but I have left room to generalize to similar acts.

Not only terrorism, but war generally, even in tribal societies. It's an old issue. So I see no need for a definition.

Terrorism is just a strategy. The US go - we blow you up, the terrorists go - we blow us up.
I think there is a need for a definition. Because everyone is against "terrorism" and defeating "terrorist ideology" but somehow it always turns out that term only applies to Muslims. So let's say what we're against, exactly, and see what that applies to.
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230

Pinetree
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Pinetree » Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:31 pm

Hmm ... I think I'm against conflict.

Inner conflict aswell (which is certainly not related to Muslims, not for me at least).

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Pasada
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Pasada » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:01 pm

I think it is imperative to understand the strategy of ISIS and other Islamic extremists, if we are to avoid playing into their hand:

The Paris Attacks Were Probably All About the Grayzone

ISIS seeks to create a black and white world defined by an apocalyptic conflict between two sides without any possibility of peaceful co-existence.

If we adopt the same worldview, we are essentially handing them victory. We are allowing them to define the conflict.

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Bundokji
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Bundokji » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:35 pm

kirk5a wrote:I think there is a need for a definition.
Terrorism is: targeting civilians to achieve political objective

Targeting: its to differentiate between inadvertent killing of civilians, and aiming to kill civilians

Civilians: targeting soldiers is not an act of terror, but an act of war

To achieve political goal: to differentiate it from murder and manslaughter (killing someone to take his money for example) and terror
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.

Dinsdale
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Dinsdale » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:42 pm

lyndon taylor wrote:ISIS members make up about .0025% of worldwide Muslims, how does that make them representative of Islam as a whole. They have about as much to do with Mainstream Islam, as Nicheren Shoshu has to do with Therevada Buddhism.
Nichiren is a Buddhist school, so I don't understand your point.
Buddha save me from new-agers!

Dinsdale
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Dinsdale » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:45 pm

Pasada wrote:Do you think if we alienate 1.6 billion people across the world, it will help or hinder the fight against ISIS?
Islam does need reform though.
Buddha save me from new-agers!

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kirk5a
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by kirk5a » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:06 pm

Spiny Norman wrote:
Pasada wrote:Do you think if we alienate 1.6 billion people across the world, it will help or hinder the fight against ISIS?
Islam does need reform though.
Does the ideology behind this sort of thing need reform too? Or no.
Image
Amnesty reported that Israel “deliberately flattened entire homes full of civilians”.
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/03/ ... rimes.html
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230

Dinsdale
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Dinsdale » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:13 pm

kirk5a wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:
Pasada wrote:Do you think if we alienate 1.6 billion people across the world, it will help or hinder the fight against ISIS?
Islam does need reform though.
Does the ideology behind this sort of thing need reform too? Or no.
It probably does, but how is that relevant to the question of Islam needing reform? A growing number of Muslims are saying that Islam does need reform and they should be supported. The mediaeval aspects of Islam simply don't belong in the 21st century.
Buddha save me from new-agers!

Dinsdale
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by Dinsdale » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:17 pm

Pasada wrote:If we adopt the same worldview, we are essentially handing them victory. We are allowing them to define the conflict.
:strawman:

Suggesting that Islam needs to reform is not the same as blaming all Muslims for the terrorism carried out by jihadists.
Buddha save me from new-agers!

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kirk5a
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Re: A Singaporean Muslim Response to the Paris Terror Attacks Goes Viral

Post by kirk5a » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:20 pm

Spiny Norman wrote:It probably does, but how is that relevant to the question of Islam needing reform? A growing number of Muslims are saying that Islam does need reform and they should be supported. The mediaeval aspects of Islam simply don't belong in the 21st century.
Which mediaeval aspects in particular do you have in mind, that is a problem for Islam, in particular, but not other countries? The deliberate killing of civilians? Or just the way they go about it?
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230

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