Do away with admins

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Mr Man
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Do away with admins

Post by Mr Man » Sat Jun 09, 2018 1:21 pm

What is the role of Admins and is it possible that that are not needed?

Couldn't decisions be made collectively by the moderation team and all moderators have an equal standing.

What are the benefits of having designated admins?

How about a collective admin account, managed by the moderation team?

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SDC
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by SDC » Sat Jun 09, 2018 1:34 pm

Interesting suggestion. However it isn't so much the decision making "authority" that distinguishes a mod from an admin, it is their access to many more board functions. Quite frankly, considering my very busy life, I would not want that added responsibility. But that's just me.

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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by Modus.Ponens » Sat Jun 09, 2018 3:43 pm

You know that David is paying for the forum, which means he will always be admin. So who do you actually want to stop being an admin?
"He turns his mind away from those phenomena and, having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' " - Jhana Sutta

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Sam Vara
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by Sam Vara » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:20 pm

In the matter of reforming things, as distinct from deforming them, there is one plain and simple principle; a principle which will probably be called a paradox. There exists in such a case a certain institution or law; let us say, for the sake of simplicity, a fence or gate erected across a road. The more modern type of reformer goes gaily up to it and says, "I don't see the use of this; let us clear it away." To which the more intelligent type of reformer will do well to answer: "If you don't see the use of it, I certainly won't let you clear it away. Go away and think. Then, when you can come back and tell me that you do see the use of it, I may allow you to destroy it."
(G.K. Chesterton)

rightviewftw
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by rightviewftw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:24 pm

They do more than you realize, apart from the adminstrative tasks and paying the bills they are the ones people talk to when there are disputes regarding account suspension and they are the ones who are or are not legally responsible at the end of the day.

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Grigoris
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by Grigoris » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:06 pm

rightviewftw wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:24 pm
They do more than you realize, apart from the adminstrative tasks and paying the bills they are the ones people talk to when there are disputes regarding account suspension and they are the ones who are or are not legally responsible at the end of the day.
The only one paying is David. Other admins have the task of administrating functions of the board that are not accessible to moderators: name changes, account deactivation, forgotten passwords, etc...
ye dhammā hetuppabhavā tesaṁ hetuṁ tathāgato āha,
tesaṃca yo nirodho - evaṁvādī mahāsamaṇo.

Of those phenomena which arise from causes:
Those causes have been taught by the Tathāgata,
And their cessation too - thus proclaims the Great Ascetic.

dharmacorps
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by dharmacorps » Sat Jun 09, 2018 8:38 pm

One of the many benefits of having moderators, even imperfect ones, is preventing a mob rule by vociferous people with an axe to grind.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Do away with admins

Post by retrofuturist » Sun Jun 10, 2018 5:13 am

Greetings Mr Man,
Mr Man wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 1:21 pm
What is the role of Admins and is it possible that that are not needed?
As mentioned, there are administrator tasks over and above the moderator role.

These include, but are certainly not limited to...

- Access rights configuration and account management
- Forum configuration, structure and layout
- Terms of Service definition
- Strategic direction
- Recruitment of staff, in line with the board strategy
- A whole raft of board parameters (as diverse as number of posts per page, through to colour schemes, permitted size & format of attachments, links to other forums)
- Chain of path escalation & auditing
- Guidance to moderators on moderating principles and ToS interpretation
- Consulting with moderators on workload management, ideas/suggestions etc.

David, as site owner also has some extra things over and above that which typically involve...

- Collaboration with the webmaster for back-end tasks and more complex requests
- Site backups and associated maintenance (e.g. version upgrades)
- Paying the bills
- Final decision-making / veto power

I tend to do most the active administration here at DWT, and as much of what can be delegated to me, is. This is important also considering David's role not only here but at DWE, DWM, Dhamma Paths, plus all his other multifarious online and meatspace Dhamma initiatives etc.

To your question "Couldn't decisions be made collectively by the moderation team and all moderators have an equal standing', many decisions are made that way. It depends upon what the decision is, the urgency of the decision etc.

For example, the decision to establish Dhamma Wheel Engaged, and split the News and Lounge discussions off into Dhamma Wheel Engaged involved brainstorming with the moderators, a member poll & discussion, followed by a full staff vote... but that process was led by the administrators. With no one owning the strategic vision of the board, there would be no one taking ownership and being responsible for doing it, leading to stagnation.

If you have any further suggestions for "co-op" style configuration of discussion forums, I suggest you present them to the phpBB3 developers, who develop the board software. Or, if you yourself looking to start a forum of your own, consider alternative platforms such as Discourse, as used at Sutta Central, which are consciously and progressively designed for the purposes of social engineering and may already have something available that conforms to your proclivities.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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