Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Tell us how you think the forum can be improved. We will listen.

In relation to "News, Current Events & Politics", I believe such discussion...

Should continue to be allowed at Dhamma Wheel, as is, because the Dhamma can influence how we see the world, and vice versa.
8
23%
Should go back to being in the Lounge, because having a dedicated section seems to give it too much prominence.
8
23%
Is fine in theory, but has become too difficult to manage in 2018, given people's attachment to views and widespread political polarization.
3
9%
Is fine in theory, but staff need to clamp down harder on serial offenders who cannot abide by the rules of that section.
1
3%
Is fine in theory, but staff unfairly oppress me and don't let me express my views.
1
3%
Should be prohibited at Dhamma Wheel altogether, because the topics and potential disputes tend to detract from the true purpose of the forum.
12
34%
Should be prohibited at Dhamma Wheel, altogether because worldly matters and religious matters should be kept separate.
1
3%
Is... (something else altogether, please explain below)
1
3%
 
Total votes: 35

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Mr Man
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Mr Man »

Hopefully this will mean an end to the "safe space" rules that were implemented for that specific forum.
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Sam Vara
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Sam Vara »

Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 12:59 pm Hopefully this will mean an end to the "safe space" rules that were implemented for that specific forum.
There are some sub-forum rules, but how do you think they relate to a "safe space"?
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Mr Man
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Mr Man »

For example - It is okay to post racist/homophobic/anti-anti-Semitic material but is not okay to call someone a racist etc.
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Sam Vara
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Sam Vara »

Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:33 pm For example - It is okay to post racist/homophobic/anti-anti-Semitic material but is not okay to call someone a racist etc.
Ah, I see. Well, that's to do with the general ToS, and presumably wouldn't change if the same content moved elsewhere, would it?
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Mr Man
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Mr Man »

It's the general terms of service that allows racist etc. views to be disseminated through a Buddhist forum.

It is the Rules for the "News, Current Events & Politics" forum that states "Whilst you may critique ideas, you may not attack or smear members who ascribe to such views".

You see a "safe space" was created.

:focus:
Last edited by Mr Man on Fri May 25, 2018 1:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
JohnK
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by JohnK »

I almost never look at that sub-forum -- the topic is not why I am here at DW.
However, I think the question of if and how it should continue could be considered in the context of the purpose of DW (in fact, that phrase is in one of the possible responses in the poll).
Perhaps there is a DW "mission statement" somewhere?
The best I could find quickly is the statement at the beginning of the TOS:
"Dhamma Wheel is an environment for the discussion of Theravada Buddhism."
If that is truly the purpose of DW, then it suggests to me that any discussion of news and current events should be primarily about how they might relate to issues of Theravada Buddhism (vs. "here is my general opinion as a forum member").
I have no strong opinion about it -- just thought that the question really brings to the fore the question of the purpose of DW.
Those who grasp at perceptions & views wander the internet creating friction. [based on Sn4:9,v.847]
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Sam Vara
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Sam Vara »

Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:53 pm It's the general terms of service that allows racist etc. views to be disseminated through a Buddhist forum.

It is the Rules for the "News, Current Events & Politics" forum that states "Whilst you may critique ideas, you may not attack or smear members who ascribe to such views".

You see a "safe space" was created.
Who is it safe for? Presumably, if you are minded to call someone a racist, then you would be better off showing how the content of their post was untenable. What is gained by playing the person, in addition to the adroit playing of the ball? There are no spaces safe from racism when such posts can be criticised.
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Pseudobabble »

Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:53 pm It's the general terms of service that allows racist etc. views to be disseminated through a Buddhist forum.

It is the Rules for the "News, Current Events & Politics" forum that states "Whilst you may critique ideas, you may not attack or smear members who ascribe to such views".

You see a "safe space" was created.

:focus:
Whereas your preference is to censor opinons and allow ad-hominem attacks?
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by User1249x »

Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:33 pm For example - It is okay to post racist/homophobic/anti-anti-Semitic material but is not okay to call someone a racist etc.
it isn't ok to call someone racist? I think it is allowed or at least tolerated, is it not? If someone holds a racist view one can call him/her out on it, whats the harm in that...
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Sam Vara »

User1249x wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 2:16 pm
Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:33 pm For example - It is okay to post racist/homophobic/anti-anti-Semitic material but is not okay to call someone a racist etc.
it isn't ok to call someone racist? I think it is allowed or at least tolerated, is it not? If someone holds a racist view one can call him/her out on it, whats the harm in that...
Surely it would be better to criticise their racist views, if such they are? That way, you are pointing out exactly where the problem lies, and you avoid a blanket condemnation of the whole person. What extra benefits are gained from labelling the person who holds the view?
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by Sam Vara »

JohnK wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:55 pm
"Dhamma Wheel is an environment for the discussion of Theravada Buddhism."
If that is truly the purpose of DW, then it suggests to me that any discussion of news and current events should be primarily about how they might relate to issues of Theravada Buddhism (vs. "here is my general opinion as a forum member").
I have no strong opinion about it -- just thought that the question really brings to the fore the question of the purpose of DW.
You make a really sound point, John, but might there also be a point to bringing a Theravadan or otherwise dhammic viewpoint to other items in the news? For example, environmental issues, disasters, or new developments in technology?
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by User1249x »

Sam Vara wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 2:51 pm
User1249x wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 2:16 pm
Mr Man wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:33 pm For example - It is okay to post racist/homophobic/anti-anti-Semitic material but is not okay to call someone a racist etc.
it isn't ok to call someone racist? I think it is allowed or at least tolerated, is it not? If someone holds a racist view one can call him/her out on it, whats the harm in that...
Surely it would be better to criticise their racist views, if such they are? That way, you are pointing out exactly where the problem lies, and you avoid a blanket condemnation of the whole person. What extra benefits are gained from labelling the person who holds the view?
yes i think it is a more polite and proper to do it like that. What i meant is that it is not the same as calling someone an asshole or c***, it is more like calling someone annihilationist or eternalist in that it is about their view. Racists are predatorized and despised so perhaps it is viewed as a more derogatory term because of it.
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by JohnK »

Sam Vara wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:03 pm
JohnK wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 1:55 pm
"Dhamma Wheel is an environment for the discussion of Theravada Buddhism."
If that is truly the purpose of DW, then it suggests to me that any discussion of news and current events should be primarily about how they might relate to issues of Theravada Buddhism (vs. "here is my general opinion as a forum member").
I have no strong opinion about it -- just thought that the question really brings to the fore the question of the purpose of DW.
You make a really sound point, John, but might there also be a point to bringing a Theravadan or otherwise dhammic viewpoint to other items in the news? For example, environmental issues, disasters, or new developments in technology?
I don't think we disagree -- discussion of news in relation to Theravada/dhamma is arguably w/in the purpose of DW (if we can take that brief statement in the TOS to be the purpose). I do still wonder if there is a more formal statement of DW's mission/purpose that can provide some context for considering the question.

Edit: I suppose The Lounge is where there is more flexibility from "discussion of Theravada Buddhism" -- so maybe the poll choice that is getting the most votes as of now is best.
Last edited by JohnK on Fri May 25, 2018 3:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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binocular
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by binocular »

It's been almost a year since this amendment has been posted:

Subject: Terms of Service amendment regarding Speech & Intention
retrofuturist wrote: Wed Jun 14, 2017 10:11 pm /.../
but such speech must remain cognizant of the fact that "Dhamma Wheel is an environment for the discussion of Theravada Buddhism". If your contributions are deemed simply to be opposing, resisting and/or diminishing those aspects of the Triple Gem, then you are not adhering to the intention of this forum, and your speech will be deemed a violation of the Terms of Service.
Except for myself, nobody replied there.

If:
"Dhamma Wheel is an environment for the discussion of Theravada Buddhism"
then there's no room for a politics forum. Or the Lounge. (Or "Connections to other paths", for that matter.)


The Forum is either going to get serious about Buddhism, or not.
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Re: Member Poll on "News, Current Events & Politics" at DW

Post by binocular »

JohnK wrote: Fri May 25, 2018 3:24 pmI do still wonder if there is a more formal statement of DW's mission/purpose that can provide some context for considering the question.
Yes, there is. I linked to it above.
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