Diversity among mods

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SDC
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by SDC » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:17 am

Saengnapha wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:11 am
SDC wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:58 pm
Saengnapha wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:11 am
Please use the real names and photos of the moderators. This should be non negotiable, IMO.
I don't use my name because the internet is full of dangerous people. It has nothing to do with avoiding accountability. Making difficult decisions day after day, having members hold unreasonable grudges against you (forever) for enforcing the rules, etc. puts enough of a stigma to my name. I can't run from that. I can't request a name change. Real name or not I'm still going to have to deal with that aspect of the role as a mod. So I have no idea what you think your suggestion would accomplish.
Sorry to hear you have this view.
What view? That's the experience of being a moderator. Don't get me wrong, there are many good things too, but unless you've been in this position it is hard for you to understand what endures after an interaction. You are tethered to it just like anywhere else. I still have to face members I've suspended, members I've disagreed with, members who do not like me, members who I may have been unfair to. Do you think that when someone I once suspended sends me a nasty PM or starts arguing with me in a thread that I have any sort of solace just because I don't use my real name? Will they not recognize me tomorrow when they feel like doing it again? Do you think that when I interact with someone who clearly doesn't trust me based on a past interaction that it doesn't make me feel bad that I am partially responsible for that?

Our ability to be consistent and reliable, that is what builds trust around here, not the ability to be caught red handed. Believe me, I've made mistakes as a moderator and I've left those situations feeling just as bad if not worse than if it had occurred offline. I don't want to be Mr Cool Mod, but I do care about being seen as fair. If I want to maintain that reputation and build on it tomorrow, I'll behave as if it were the offline world. I'm curious as to why you assume we do not hold ourselves to any sort of standard and that we somehow have the ability to sit behind these names with no accountability. Because let me tell you, I've been held accountable plenty of times.

I don't know, maybe we are misunderstanding each other here. Who knows...

Saengnapha
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by Saengnapha » Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:17 am

SDC wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:17 am

What view?
I'm talking about the narrative that you construct for yourself based on your experience that allows you to identify with circumstances. Cognizing yourself as someone is a view. Using strategies to 'protect' this someone is the activity of emotional reaction. That is all I am saying and hopefully what each of us is discovering.

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Dhammarakkhito
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by Dhammarakkhito » Tue Jan 09, 2018 7:33 am

:namaste: diversity for diversity's sake necessitates segregation by such factors as race, gender, and so on
by abandoning these factors, we can diminish their impact
abandon diversity for the sake of unity :anjali:

i do however support adding asian mod(s). western buddhism... has its limits
"Just as the ocean has a single taste — that of salt — in the same way, this Dhamma-Vinaya has a single taste: that of release."
— Ud 5.5

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robertk
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by robertk » Tue Jan 09, 2018 7:41 am

here you go: a photo of me in vietnam.
There was a link to a video somewhere too, where I am giving some explanation about the text a monk is chanting.

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=15952&hilit=sujin&start=1260

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SDC
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by SDC » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:03 pm

Saengnapha wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:17 am
SDC wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:17 am

What view?
I'm talking about the narrative that you construct for yourself based on your experience that allows you to identify with circumstances. Cognizing yourself as someone is a view. Using strategies to 'protect' this someone is the activity of emotional reaction. That is all I am saying and hopefully what each of us is discovering.
Ah, a psych-Dhamma guy...we would've been pals about 5 years ago. :tongue:

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binocular
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by binocular » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:54 pm

aflatun wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:06 pm
SDC wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:10 pm
But a brick wall at 100 km doesn't care how many cylinders your engine has, so best not to take ourselves too serious. :smile:
The only way to drive, especially in California post 1/1/18
Reminiscing another Jeff Bridges car crash scene --


from 3.20 onwards

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binocular
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by binocular » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:03 pm

binocular wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:17 pm
https://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.p ... 37#p385437

I regard the input of anonymous users who are unknown to me with only slightly more regard than the ramblings of the town drunk.
/.../
When we know who a person is, what they do, who their teachers are, there is more basis for trust in what they say.
And the rest of the thread ...
However, after having given this more thought, Malcolm and some other Vajrayanists who think similarly about anyonymity as he does, do have a pertinent point: In Vajrayana, the personal is paramount to spiritual practice. Because in Vajrayana, there is so much focus on receiving initiations, empowerments, having a teacher, being an active member of a particular group, etc. that it only makes sense that people come as they are, for real.
Theravada, on the other hand, tends to be quite different, with much less emphasis on initiations etc.

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binocular
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by binocular » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:04 pm

Saengnapha wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:17 am
I'm talking about the narrative that you construct for yourself based on your experience that allows you to identify with circumstances. Cognizing yourself as someone is a view. Using strategies to 'protect' this someone is the activity of emotional reaction. That is all I am saying and hopefully what each of us is discovering.
In that case, what does it matter whether someone posts under their real name and appearance or not?

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binocular
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by binocular » Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:01 pm

SDC wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:17 am
That's the experience of being a moderator.
/.../
I haven't thought that such could be the case.
I suppose the person travelling by horse knows nothing about the troubles of the person travelling on foot; and the person travelling on foot knows nothing about the troubles of the person travelling by horse ...
I'm curious as to why you assume we do not hold ourselves to any sort of standard and that we somehow have the ability to sit behind these names with no accountability.
Because from the perspective of an ordinary poster who occupies a (much) lesser position of power than a moderator, this is what a moderator appears like. Also, the way some moderators have handled things (such as the way they gave out warnings) easily leads to getting the impression that this person is not accountable to anyone and can do as they please. Add to this if in open forums, such a moderator happens to be a big proponent of the no-self doctrine, or interprets the anatta doctrine in a manner of "Just get rid of self-view, and all will be well".
Because let me tell you, I've been held accountable plenty of times.
But what has come of it?

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aflatun
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by aflatun » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm

If anyone is wondering this is a photo of me in real life:

The skinnier one on the left

And I live in North Hollywood on Radford, near the In-and-Out Burger
Last edited by aflatun on Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"People often get too quick to say 'there's no self. There's no self...no self...no self.' There is self, there is focal point, its not yours. That's what not self is."

Ninoslav Ñāṇamoli
Senses and the Thought-1, 42:53

"Those who create constructs about the Buddha,
Who is beyond construction and without exhaustion,
Are thereby damaged by their constructs;
They fail to see the Thus-Gone.

That which is the nature of the Thus-Gone
Is also the nature of this world.
There is no nature of the Thus-Gone.
There is no nature of the world."

Nagarjuna
MMK XXII.15-16

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aflatun
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by aflatun » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm

robertk wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 7:41 am
here you go: a photo of me in vietnam.
There was a link to a video somewhere too, where I am giving some explanation about the text a monk is chanting.

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=15952&hilit=sujin&start=1260
Great photo and a great thread!
"People often get too quick to say 'there's no self. There's no self...no self...no self.' There is self, there is focal point, its not yours. That's what not self is."

Ninoslav Ñāṇamoli
Senses and the Thought-1, 42:53

"Those who create constructs about the Buddha,
Who is beyond construction and without exhaustion,
Are thereby damaged by their constructs;
They fail to see the Thus-Gone.

That which is the nature of the Thus-Gone
Is also the nature of this world.
There is no nature of the Thus-Gone.
There is no nature of the world."

Nagarjuna
MMK XXII.15-16

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bodom
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by bodom » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:16 pm

Would you like my social security number as well?
:tongue:

:namaste:
To study is to know the texts,
To practice is to know your defilements,
To attain the goal is to know and let go.

- Ajahn Lee Dhammadharo


With no struggling, no thinking,
the mind, still,
will see cause and effect
vanishing in the Void.
Attached to nothing, letting go:
Know that this is the way
to allay all stress.

- Upasika Kee Nanayan

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binocular
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by binocular » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:27 pm

aflatun wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm
If anyone is wondering this is a photo of me in real life:
The skinner one on the left
Is that a hair net you're wearing?

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aflatun
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by aflatun » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:31 pm

binocular wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:27 pm
aflatun wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm
If anyone is wondering this is a photo of me in real life:
The skinner one on the left
Is that a hair net you're wearing?
Yes, sometimes my hair gets out of control. It's probably a middle eastern thing...
"People often get too quick to say 'there's no self. There's no self...no self...no self.' There is self, there is focal point, its not yours. That's what not self is."

Ninoslav Ñāṇamoli
Senses and the Thought-1, 42:53

"Those who create constructs about the Buddha,
Who is beyond construction and without exhaustion,
Are thereby damaged by their constructs;
They fail to see the Thus-Gone.

That which is the nature of the Thus-Gone
Is also the nature of this world.
There is no nature of the Thus-Gone.
There is no nature of the world."

Nagarjuna
MMK XXII.15-16

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binocular
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by binocular » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:33 pm

No_Mind wrote:
Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:47 am
While I welcome that Sam is the new moderator .. maybe DW needs some diversity in its 9th year .. an Asian mod (Sarath possibly .. he almost lives here .. might as well mod while he is here) .. maybe a female mod (unless there already is one .. I do not think so ..) .. a black mod maybe (unless there already is one)

Just a suggestion.
As far as diversity is concerned, what possibly could make a difference is if there would be more turnover among the moderators, ie. that someone could be a moderator only for a limited amount of time specified in advance. It seems this could go a long way in undoing the impression that there are two classes of people at this forum -- the elite (ie. the moderators) and the plebeians (ie. the ordinary posters); and also in undoing some of the tension between the moderators and the ordinary posters.

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robertk
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by robertk » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:57 pm

aflatun wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:12 pm
robertk wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 7:41 am
here you go: a photo of me in vietnam.
There was a link to a video somewhere too, where I am giving some explanation about the text a monk is chanting.

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=15952&hilit=sujin&start=1260
Great photo and a great thread!
:anjali: thanks!

Circle5
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by Circle5 » Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:50 am

binocular wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:33 pm
As far as diversity is concerned, what possibly could make a difference is if there would be more turnover among the moderators, ie. that someone could be a moderator only for a limited amount of time specified in advance. It seems this could go a long way in undoing the impression that there are two classes of people at this forum -- the elite (ie. the moderators) and the plebeians (ie. the ordinary posters); and also in undoing some of the tension between the moderators and the ordinary posters.
:goodpost: Lack of any anti-mod abuse laws is just bound to cause troubles.


As for the stupid ideas about posting your picture and social security number and everything possible about yourself on a buddhist forum.... Imagine doing that if you are from an ultra-religious country like mine. I would never do such things on any forum, let alone a buddhist one.

Some people ask me surprised why don't I use facebook. I never had a picture and only use it from time to time to find old friends. I always ask them back: why should I, what would be the benefit of it. And that's the point where nobody can give an answer. There is zero advantage in having a facebook picture or using facebook as a whole, people just do it cause everybody else does it or for pleasure. Using facebook is just a form of entertainment same as watching football or video games, plus it's a pleasure that is rising narcissism. It has zero utility. You can do just fine phoning people that you need to meet. Not to mention how much time it would consume. If you post a picture, you need to post a good one. Then you need to post more to have a complete good looking profile, then make sure it has enough likes, etc. It would take so much time to maintain the profile at a good level and would bring me no money.

I see the exact zero utility in having people post their pictures, social security numbers or any kind of personal information on forums. What is being said is important, not who said it.

As for chosing moderators based on race as OP asked, I see no utility in that either. There is no scientific evidence that chosing people based on race has a good impact on business efficiency. Why would it have any efficiency on a forum ? Besides the lack of empirical evidence, I see no logic behind it.

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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by mikenz66 » Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:57 am

Regarding identity, there is photo of Ven Dhammanando and I posing for a publicity shot here:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2730&start=60#p369695

There was a picture of Robert and I earlier in that thread, but it seems to have become corrupt...

:heart:
Mike

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aflatun
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by aflatun » Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:01 am

mikenz66 wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:57 am
Regarding identity, there is photo of Ven Dhammanando and I posing for a publicity shot here:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2730&start=60#p369695

There was a picture of Robert and I earlier in that thread, but it seems to have become corrupt...

:heart:
Mike
What a great photo!
"People often get too quick to say 'there's no self. There's no self...no self...no self.' There is self, there is focal point, its not yours. That's what not self is."

Ninoslav Ñāṇamoli
Senses and the Thought-1, 42:53

"Those who create constructs about the Buddha,
Who is beyond construction and without exhaustion,
Are thereby damaged by their constructs;
They fail to see the Thus-Gone.

That which is the nature of the Thus-Gone
Is also the nature of this world.
There is no nature of the Thus-Gone.
There is no nature of the world."

Nagarjuna
MMK XXII.15-16

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DNS
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Re: Diversity among mods

Post by DNS » Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:16 am

I'm an AJNAE (Jew-North African-Arab-European).
viewtopic.php?f=45&t=30999#p452765

Does that count for diversity? :tongue:

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