It is kind of weird that there is not one sticky Meditation thread.
There are many worthy threads on the forum so there is no lack of resources.
Another thing i want to suggest is having a Debate Sub for people who want to engage in such past-time.
Debates should also be more formal imo, ie the thread titled
"the great Nibbana = annihilation, eternal, or something else thread"
We know it is definitely not annihilation or eternal, why legitimize these views? I doubt people with Right View would touch that thread with a ten foot pole and if they did their posts would get buried there.
I think having a more orderly debate space will make people debate less and more effectively.
Right view, Right meditation and Right Speech(debate/discussion) should be promoted and it is Admin's responsibility.
Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
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Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
Last edited by User156079 on Sun Apr 16, 2017 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
There is a great jhana thread already.User156079 wrote:It is kind of weird that there is not one sticky Meditation thread.
There are many worthy threads on the forum so there is no lack of resources.
This thread exists and is already pinned.Another thing i want to suggest is having a Debate Sub for people who want to engage in such past-time.
Debates should also be more formal imo, ie the thread titled
"the great Nibbana = annihilation, eternal, or something else thread"
How do you know this? Also, what some might call "Right View" another would call annihilation. So people need help and clarification with these issues.We know it is definitely not annihilation or eternal, why legitimize these views?
On the contrary, I think someone with Right View would want to help others with their issues regarding that topic.I doubt people with Right View would touch that thread with a ten foot pole and if they did their posts would get buried there.
From the terms of service:Right view, Right meditation and Right Speech(debate/discussion) should be promoted and it is Admin's responsibility.
It would be a bad precedent for admins and moderators to be the "Dhamma-Police" -- rather it is the duty of admins and moderators to enforce the terms of service, anything else would be imposing their own views on the membership.Terms of Service wrote:Members are expected to self-moderate, being mindful of the adage that 'behaviour breeds behaviour'. Mutual respect and friendliness should be the basis of all interactions. If you find anything objectionable, let the administrators or moderators know using the Report Post function, but refrain from posting public responses because meta-discussion has the tendency to derail topics.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
Why not make a FAQ or something with cliffs from that thread or analogue in example or pinning some of the most informative threads we have on meditation or making a compilation of sorts.David N. Snyder wrote: There is a great jhana thread already.
This is not hard to know, because there are Suttas directly contradicting alot of it, of the top of my headDavid N. Snyder wrote: How do you know this? Also, what some might call "Right View" another would call annihilation. So people need help and clarification with these issues
Brahmajāla Sutta: The All-embracing Net of Views
and whole of SN 44.x Chapter
should give a very clear idea of what is wrong view at the minimum.
One can define Annihilation and Eternalism according to the Sutta and there is absolutely no risk in going wrong there in regards to "breaking Buddhism" or something.
I think a person holding Right View would want to contribute but would probably not be interested in Debating in that format. Why because there is no order to it, if some Ariya was to write a lengthy post there, there would be several people saying nah we don't believe it without any proof or proper evidence, there is no end to it as i see it.David N. Snyder wrote: On the contrary, I think someone with Right View would want to help others with their issues regarding that topic.
IE i read the thread about Ajahn Mun, and a member refered to Sutta Pitaka as ink on paper and i am under impression that this is well tolerated, how is one supposed to debate under these conditions.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
You have quoted some Sutta references, which are open to interpretation and in fact have been interpreted in various ways by Buddhists.User156079 wrote: This is not hard to know, because there are Suttas directly contradicting alot of it, of the top of my head
Brahmajāla Sutta: The All-embracing Net of Views
and whole of SN 44.x Chapter
should give a very clear idea of what is wrong view at the minimum.
The Buddha taught the Dhamma to all, even the foolish ones. Many times he convinced them and got them on the right path, other times he did not convince them; at least he tried.I think a person holding Right View would want to contribute but would probably not be interested in Debating in that format. Why because there is no order to it, if some Ariya was to write a lengthy post there, there would be several people saying nah we don't believe it without any proof or proper evidence, there is no end to it as i see it.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
I doubt most people who are debating the Nibbana thread have read those Suttas tho, i think it would help alot if there were some qualification to the debate, as in atleast having read those Suttas or atleast agreeing on Authority (Sutta Pitaka or Tipitaka) takes about an hour. We should be debating these interpretations and getting to bottom of it otherwise it is kind of pointless.David N. Snyder wrote: You have quoted some Sutta references, which are open to interpretation and in fact have been interpreted in various ways by Buddhists.
I am all for diversity of educated opinions but frankly i dont think people are entitled to be taked seriously if they dont have one.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
Here someone just calls Word of the Tathagata for black ink on paper. I cant stand it, its really hurtful and is not right.identification wrote: Does anyone actually think they could ever go to Luangta with some black ink on paper and say look Luangta! You see you're wrong! Without being completely embarrassed and annihilated. It's easy to argue with an Ajahn that isn't here to defend himself.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
Take it easy, it's just a discussion. He is entitled to his view just as you are free to counter his opinion.User156079 wrote: Here someone just calls Word of the Tathagata for black ink on paper. I cant stand it, its really hurtful and is not right.
Maybe it's a test of your equanimity, to help you along.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
It almost makes me cry tbh and not want to participate.David N. Snyder wrote:Take it easy, it's just a discussion. He is entitled to his view just as you are free to counter his opinion.User156079 wrote: Here someone just calls Word of the Tathagata for black ink on paper. I cant stand it, its really hurtful and is not right.
Maybe it's a test of your equanimity, to help you along.
We have authority of the Tipitaka, i understand it is not easy to tell whats right but it is not so hard to tell whats wrong often.Then the Blessed One said to Ven. Ananda, "Now, if it occurs to any of you — 'The teaching has lost its authority; we are without a Teacher' — do not view it in that way. Whatever Dhamma & Vinaya I have pointed out & formulated for you, that will be your Teacher when I am gone.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
want to suggest once again a Separate moderated Debate subforum which is moderated according to these Suttas.
Kathavatthu Sutta: Topics for Discussion
Viggahika Sutta: Wordy Warfare
Kathavatthu Sutta: Topics of Conversation (1)
I think it would even make the thumbs up etc redundant and would definitely promote Right View naturally, because Right View shines in proper debate and it will always win given fair opportunity.
I would like to debate in that format and i think others would appreciate such platform as well, perhaps we could even have some profiled teachers come and debate in future.
In the Suttas we often see debates and cross questioning, but it is always done in orderly fashion and is therefore productive.
Kathavatthu Sutta: Topics for Discussion
Viggahika Sutta: Wordy Warfare
Kathavatthu Sutta: Topics of Conversation (1)
I think it would even make the thumbs up etc redundant and would definitely promote Right View naturally, because Right View shines in proper debate and it will always win given fair opportunity.
I would like to debate in that format and i think others would appreciate such platform as well, perhaps we could even have some profiled teachers come and debate in future.
In the Suttas we often see debates and cross questioning, but it is always done in orderly fashion and is therefore productive.
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
Greetings [name redacted by admin],
If you wish to host a structured debate, then by all means, you are welcome to start a topic to do so. A new forum is not required for that...
Metta,
Paul.
If you wish to host a structured debate, then by all means, you are welcome to start a topic to do so. A new forum is not required for that...
Metta,
Paul.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Re: Sticky/Pinned Threads and debates.
That is true, sometimes its hard to see the obvious solution.