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by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:59 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

The descriptions above seem to refer to living creatures, and not to the cells which make them up. The difficulty is trying to work out from the suttas when dukkha completely and finally ceases. Suttas like this one tend to muddy the water: https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn38/sn38.014....
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:54 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

I'm sure part of it is the mental anguish associated with the thought of extinction. Though I suspect it goes deeper than this, as much biology as psychology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-preservation The wikipedia article is really weak. It mostly talks about organisms in general and what it...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:49 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

It seems quite clear that its about the aging & death of "a being", such as the aging & death of my wife, my mother, myself, my dog, etc. If there is no "person" or "personal object" decaying & ceasing, I doubt suffering can arise. Lets quote a translation again for reflection: So now you are claim...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:00 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

Here is an extract from MN141, which elaborates on aspects of the First Noble Truth. As with DO, birth, aging and death are clearly described in biological/physical terms: "What, your reverence, is the Noble Truth of suffering? Birth is suffering; aging is suffering; death is suffering; grief, lame...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:54 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Tips for dealing with intrusive noise when practicing mindfulness?
Replies: 8
Views: 436

Re: Tips for dealing with intrusive noise when practicing mindfulness?

Mindfulness practice is about attending to whatever is happening here and now, it's not about shutting out some experiences and concentrating on others, it sounds like you are doing concentration practice not mindfulness practice. With mindfulness practice you should notice that you are hearing, no...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:51 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

Birth is included in the first Noble Truth, so it is an aspect of dukkha. There is biological birth, but in the context of the third noble truth, how do you think birth should be understood? Here is an extract from MN141, which elaborates on aspects of the First Noble Truth. As with DO, birth, agin...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:39 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

I think it would be good if you explained what you personally see as being the suffering which comes about through death. I'm sure part of it is the mental anguish associated with the thought of extinction. Though I suspect it goes deeper than this, as much biology as psychology: https://en.wikiped...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:19 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

James Tan wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:42 am
So it seems Entire mass of suffering does covers from birth to death .
Birth is included in the first Noble Truth, so it is an aspect of dukkha.

Note that the suttas support the idea of repeated births.
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dha ... msara.html
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:17 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

There is a physical process of birth and of death but what I can argue that the old man died (but baby did not die). Likewise the baby was born (but the old man was never born) unless you believed there to be an entity/self that was somehow born from somewhere and continues on in some form after de...
by Dinsdale
Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:12 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

To Dinsdale the descriptions have a strong physical/biological component. But to DooDoot, the description merely describes strong identification of "a being" with the physical/biological component. When aging & death come near, obviously, the ordinary person most strongly identifies with the decay,...
by Dinsdale
Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:40 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

Therefore Dinsdale was never born. Oh yes I was, and I have a birth certificate to prove it. :tongue: But seriously, there seems to be a fudging of the issue here, an attempt to conflate physical birth and identity view, to conflate the biological and the psychological. But these are not the same.
by Dinsdale
Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:33 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

..if you didn't see a brick hitting your foot you might not fabricate the concept of a brick hitting your foot....you might fabricate the concept that someone stepped on your foot.....the painful bodily feeling prompts you to fabricate what is its cause. chownah But the pain is there, regardless of...
by Dinsdale
Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:28 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

Just as, with an assemblage of parts, The word 'chariot' is used, So, when the aggregates are present, There's the convention 'a being .' https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn05/sn05.010.bodh.html[/i] It appears physical (rupa) "assumed" to be "a being" is unrelated to what "a being" actua...
by Dinsdale
Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:59 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link
Replies: 100
Views: 1101

Re: Dependant Arising - 2nd Link

James Tan wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:20 pm
The baby cannot think yet , but the physical body is reality . You are talking about psychological aspect of the human being .
Indeed. And this distinction ( bodily v. mental ) is present in the suttas.
by Dinsdale
Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:48 am
Forum: General Theravāda Meditation
Topic: Anapanasati - Step 7 and 8
Replies: 28
Views: 557

Re: Anapanasati - Step 7 and 8

Zom wrote:
Sat Sep 15, 2018 11:22 am
And still, according to Buddha himself (MN 118), 4 anapanasti tetrads are 4 satipatthanas, and again, 4 satipatthanas are not steps .)
I think the four tetrads of anapanasati describe a progression, while the four frames of satipatthana can be practiced individually.