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by mikenz66
Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:27 am
Forum: General Theravāda Meditation
Topic: How non-conceptual is "non-conceptual" vipassana, really?
Replies: 11
Views: 214

Re: How non-conceptual is "non-conceptual" vipassana, really?

I think it's a great question. Ven Nananda has a lot of detail in his mediation booklet on this, which I've reproduced a number of times. I think people make too much of a meal the "non-conceptual", "ultimate reality" translations. Nananada takes the regular progression one sees in Mahasi intruction...
by mikenz66
Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:09 pm
Forum: Early Buddhism
Topic: why is authenticity under-valued
Replies: 31
Views: 360

Re: why is authenticity under-valued

It's not undervalued. It's just that some people don't accept "scientific history" or materialist textual criticism as the only criterion of authenticity. ... Well said. It would seem somewhat ironic to over-emphasise a scientific/materialistic approach to verifying the authenticity of a religious ...
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:11 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Sorry, I have put a lot of information into this discussion, and I am not going to repeat myself, or try to summarise. If you have a specifc question about something that I have posted, by all means ask it.

:heart:
Mike
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:54 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Well, I thought he did a pretty good job in the post I linked to: https://discourse.suttacentral.net/t/what-is-the-meaning-of-nama-in-nama-rupa/4600/2?u=mikenz66 And if you listen to Ven Analyo's discussion and read Ven Nananda's lecture, it makes a lot more sense. I gave all of the links near the s...
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:48 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

I read already , I could not see where him defining nama rupa . Maybe you can summarize it here . See, for example: https://discourse.suttacentral.net/t/what-is-the-meaning-of-nama-in-nama-rupa/4600/2 You are looking at a tree , both related , but both being different also . What I meant is nama ru...
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:06 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Hi , but sujato didn't explain what namarupa actually is ? You have to read the whole thread for his definition. He seems right that it is about relation rather than something separate . However , Namarupa is not to be treated as mentality materiality aka as a single unit . I disagree. Mind-body is...
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:00 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Sure, but is anyone here arguing differently? I still don't see a problem with discussing mentality and materiality ( whatever ) as different aspects of the whole, and for that reason I still don't see a problem with the hyphen in nama-rupa. I think that the problem is the idea that they can be sep...
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:19 am
Forum: Suggestion box
Topic: Diversity among mods
Replies: 93
Views: 1389

Re: Diversity among mods

aflatun wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:01 am
What a great photo!
Thanks. I also like the picture of the naga a few posts later...
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2730&start=60#p369744

:heart:
Mike
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:57 am
Forum: Suggestion box
Topic: Diversity among mods
Replies: 93
Views: 1389

Re: Diversity among mods

Regarding identity, there is photo of Ven Dhammanando and I posing for a publicity shot here:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2730&start=60#p369695

There was a picture of Robert and I earlier in that thread, but it seems to have become corrupt...

:heart:
Mike
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:51 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

You might find this post (#7) interesting Thanks, yes that thread about namarupa on Sutta Central is very useful. As I said in my OP: https://dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=30921#p451130 ... western philosopy and "spirituality" have this idea of a "mind" or "spirit", which is the important bi...
by mikenz66
Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:02 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Which Senior Theravada monks should ideally discuss and explore with each other over which topics?
Replies: 57
Views: 759

Re: Which Senior Theravada monks should ideally discuss and explore with each other over which topics?

I too read those exchanges between Ajahn Thanissaro, and Bhikkhu Bodhi. Whomever squares off with Ajahn Thanissaro had better be as clever as about 25 foxes and as sharp as a samurai sword. Do you really think so, Bhante? I like listening Ajahn Thanissaro from time to time - he has some interesting...
by mikenz66
Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:02 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

There are many variations in the suttas. See, for example: https://suttacentral.net/en/sn12.65 which also excludes ignorance and sankhara... There are 'abridged' versions of D.O. (which I already posted) but I am not aware of any variations, such as DN 15. DN 15 is a different beast. I think suttas...
by mikenz66
Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:29 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Nama-rupa is indeed a difficult, but important part of the Buddha's Mahanidana Sutta. "The Buddha's" Mahanidana Sutta? Any evidence for why the Buddha would provide a largely different teaching of D.O., in many aspects? That is: 1. Exclude ignorance 2. Exclude sankhara 3. Explain consciousness diff...
by mikenz66
Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:43 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Yes, but should we read it as "this occurs then this occurs"?

:spy:
Mike
by mikenz66
Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:14 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

OK,thanks. Yes, there are these two cases, with the case you mention and in https://suttacentral.net/en/sn12.65 consciousness and name-and-form have a mutual dependency. “Then, bhikkhus, it occurred to me: ‘When what exists does consciousness come to be? By what is consciousness conditioned? ’ Then,...
by mikenz66
Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:47 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

..... I find it quite difficult to fathom some of the language used in the suttas. I'm not even sure if they are really the Buddhas exact words! or have they been re-arranged or badly translated? Well, of course, that's always a possibility, but the Pali suttas, and their parallels, are what we hav...
by mikenz66
Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:48 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

This thread is getting a little muddy, I think. I didn't post that sutta quote. How could naming occur before visual contact? It seems the image must be constructed before the naming of it. I agree with Chownah that the self appears to be a mental formation, sankhara. It seems to happen during the ...
by mikenz66
Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:23 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Greetings, There's some interesting analysis on pages 19 & 20 of Ven. Nanananda's Paticcasamuppada Sermon 1. Unfortunately I can't copy and paste the relevant text because the PDF file is locked down. Metta, Paul. :) Hi Retro, You mean this passage? http://seeingthroughthenet.net/wp-content/uploads...
by mikenz66
Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:25 am
Forum: Suggestion box
Topic: Forum search
Replies: 9
Views: 233

Re: Forum search

Personally, I think the built-in search function of this particular software is not very good, even when it is working. It's working for me, but slowly.

I find it much faster and more useful to do a google search along the lines of:
site:dhammawheel.com keywords
:heart:
by mikenz66
Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:19 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?
Replies: 124
Views: 1420

Re: Nāmarūpa - Named Form?

Hi Saengnapha, When we discuss these things, the translations of words can vary quite a bit. I see that we think of the same processes but use a different word for it. Let's not make it a sticking point. Perhaps we should stick to English to describe the process of perception and name and form. ... ...