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by ToVincent
Wed Oct 02, 2019 5:50 am
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

... You are just hopeless, with your sutta's references, with no parallel for the extract you are quoting. And just useless in your rationale about not using parallels. You are just hopeless when it comes to your choice of a translator. In this instance - (AN 11.2) - the lousy translator that is Su...
by ToVincent
Tue Oct 01, 2019 5:55 pm
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

Oh? Viharati deserves to mean “to fetch apart”? But since when has “to fetch apart” meant anything at all? Well then, find someone to translate ToVincent. I am pretty sure that some smart guy, might understand what asunder (apart) means, when one has to fetch (or convey or take back) DISTINCTIVELY ...
by ToVincent
Tue Oct 01, 2019 10:37 am
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

.. I have tried to answer your question (c) in your original post, by giving you a proper grammar, based on a proper lexicography. You can't just brush either one aside. Can you? The proper lexicography for viharati is about distinction/discernment - viz. fetch (√ हृ hṛ), apart (वि vi). The proper ...
by ToVincent
Tue Oct 01, 2019 3:27 am
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

... :redherring: Then I repeat myself: Dhammanando & doodoot are keen on grammar when they want to, aren't they? Well then, the context should decide. 1. "Contemplator of the body" >> I see no "discernment" into that. As said before, √ paś has the meaning of "discernment" across Mn. and MBh - (that...
by ToVincent
Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:07 pm
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

Well then, the context should decide. 1. "Contemplator of the body" >> I see no "discernment" into that. As said before, √ paś has the meaning of "discernment" across Mn. and MBh - (that is to say across Buddha's time). 2. "the noticeable body" >> In which case there is "discernment" between two bod...
by ToVincent
Mon Sep 30, 2019 1:25 pm
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

Yet, the above would be correct if: 1. Anupassī were to come from the verb anu+passati that were to mean "to contemplate". However, the meaning of अनुपश् anupaś [ anu-√ paś ], in Sanskrit, means to look at , perceive, notice. (RV, ŚBr, BṛĀr.Up, ChUp.). And √ paś has the meaning of "discernment" acro...
by ToVincent
Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:23 pm
Forum: General Theravāda Meditation
Topic: He breathes far (lofty) & close (low)
Replies: 8
Views: 531

Re: He breathes far (lofty) & close (low)

Ultimately, one should breathe [in & out] far/dīgha (aka "lofty"), as in doing it from the nāmarūpa nidāna (that indeed inherits the assāsapassāsā [kāyasaṅkhāro] from the saṅkhārā nidāna, via the viññāṇa nidāna) - And one should breathe [in & out] close/rassa (aka "low",) as doing it from the saḷāya...
by ToVincent
Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:32 pm
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

Still, the proper translation, as said before, would be the noticeable (or perceivable) body [far OR close]; (or bodies [far AND close]), among the body (namely the sabbakāya). But that would be a hard thing to admit from the proponent of an "everything comes from the senses" - as an empiricist, or ...
by ToVincent
Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:18 am
Forum: Pāli
Topic: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati
Replies: 30
Views: 692

Re: Translation questions about satipatthana & anapanasati

Kāye kāyānupassī viharāhi. He fetches apart the noticeable bodies [far & close] among the body (singular) [sabbakāya]. NOTE: Kāye kāyānupassī viharāhi. Anupassin/anupassī is an adjective. अनुपश् anupaś [ anu-√ paś ], in Sanskrit, means to look at , perceive, notice. (RV, ŚBr., BṛĀr.Up, ChUp.). The ...
by ToVincent
Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:15 am
Forum: General Theravāda Meditation
Topic: He breathes far (lofty) & close (low)
Replies: 8
Views: 531

Re: He breathes far (lofty) & close (low)

For those who are still attached to suttas without parallels; or attached to suttas considered as late (like MN10 & DN 22) - one might still argue that "long & short" in the simile of the lathe, might well be properly translated as "far & close". A close turn in the sapwood. A far turn towards the h...
by ToVincent
Tue Sep 24, 2019 6:58 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking it
Replies: 25
Views: 505

Re: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking

Please, do correct the above paragraph : For instance, is sukhañca kayena in the 3rd jhana, a physical body pleasure ? - or is it the sukha (citta-like or independent), (produced) from the body/breath, or body/ayatana? (The fundamental use of the instrumental (case) in Pāli as in the older languages...
by ToVincent
Mon Sep 23, 2019 3:41 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking it
Replies: 25
Views: 505

Re: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking

... 心悅 Your choice: https://suttacentral.net/search?query=%22%E5%BF%83%E6%82%85%22 I am not saying they are absolutely right. There might be some nuance to be applied here. __________ Clue: You have told me above that my note on kāya was irrelevant to this matter. Maybe you should wonder what the n...
by ToVincent
Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:01 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking it
Replies: 25
Views: 505

Re: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking

... (Pīti-manassa) kāyo passambhati. (Passaddha-kāyo) sukhaṃ vedeti. (Sukhino) cittaṃ samādhiyati. (Samāhite citte) dhammā pātubhavanti. For one with a rapturous mind, the body becomes tranquil. One tranquil in body feels pleasure. For one feeling pleasure, the mind becomes concentrated. Bodhi When...
by ToVincent
Mon Sep 23, 2019 6:20 am
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking it
Replies: 25
Views: 505

Re: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking

sukha is not the adjective for citta in the 7sb awakening factor sequence, and you're the eel wriggler. It's comical how often the offender of misdeed preemptively accuses the other party of their misdeed. For your record, I would like to remind you that SN 46.3 does not have "50 other references",...
by ToVincent
Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:32 pm
Forum: General Theravāda discussion
Topic: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking it
Replies: 25
Views: 505

Re: looking for citation, pīti and sukha of 4 jhānas compared to dying of thirst, seeing water in distance, and drinking

Here's Bodhi's translation. The sukhino is referring to the person experiencing pleasure, it's not an adjective for citta. “For one whose mind is uplifted by rapture the body becomes tranquil and the mind becomes tranquil. Whenever, bhikkhus, the body becomes tranquil and the mind becomes tranquil ...