YOU CANNOT POST. OUR WEB HOSTING COMPANY DECIDED TO MOVE THE SERVER TO ANOTHER LOCATION. IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN VIEW THIS VERSION WHICH DOES NOT ALLOW POSTING AND WILL NOT SAVE ANYTHING YOU DO ONCE THE OTHER SERVER GOES ONLINE.

How common is stream entry? - Dhamma Wheel

How common is stream entry?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
User avatar
m0rl0ck
Posts: 1160
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2009 10:51 am

How common is stream entry?

Postby m0rl0ck » Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:16 am

“The truth knocks on the door and you say, "Go away, I'm looking for the truth," and so it goes away. Puzzling.” ― Robert M. Pirsig

User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby jcsuperstar » Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:20 am

สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

User avatar
octathlon
Posts: 599
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 5:06 am
Location: USA

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby octathlon » Sat Aug 14, 2010 3:20 pm


PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby PeterB » Sat Aug 14, 2010 3:33 pm

I agree. I think that the timeless moment is actually quite easily accessed , but not easily sustained. And only with some difficulty does it become our default state.
This sustaining in my opinion is made more difficult by the institutional descent of what is a state of freedom into categorisation and signs indicating status. Stream winner and once returner etc language represents the institutionalisation of the Buddha Dhamma. Its essential radical liberation is rendered less scary by imagined classifications..like prize winning marrows at the local county show. With Gold or red or blue stickers.
Real stream entry imo is the experience of the nature of things which thereafter always colours our view to a greater or lesser extent.
We are not in Kansas anymore Toto....

rowyourboat
Posts: 1952
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:29 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby rowyourboat » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:17 pm

SN 13.1 PTS: S ii 133 CDB i 621
Nakhasikha Sutta: The Tip of the Fingernail
translated from the Pali by
Thanissaro Bhikkhu
© 1999–2010
I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying near Savatthi at Jeta's Grove, Anathapindika's monastery. Then the Blessed One, picking up a little bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monks, "What do you think, monks? Which is greater: the little bit of dust I have picked up with the tip of my fingernail, or the great earth?"

"The great earth is far greater, lord. The little bit of dust the Blessed One has picked up with the tip of his fingernail is next to nothing. It's not a hundredth, a thousandth, a one hundred-thousandth — this little bit of dust the Blessed One has picked up with the tip of his fingernail — when compared with the great earth."

"In the same way, monks, for a disciple of the noble ones who is consummate in view, an individual who has broken through [to stream-entry], the suffering & stress that is totally ended & extinguished is far greater. That which remains in the state of having at most seven remaining lifetimes is next to nothing: it's not a hundredth, a thousandth, a one hundred-thousandth, when compared with the previous mass of suffering. That's how great the benefit is of breaking through to the Dhamma, monks. That's how great the benefit is of obtaining the Dhamma eye." (stream entry)

Real streamentry comes after doing this (see link), not a peaceful walk in the park:

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... gress.html

with metta

RYB
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

vesuyul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2010 4:21 pm

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby vesuyul » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:33 pm

how common is stream entry?

A sotapanna has unshakeable faith in the Buddha, Dhamma, and Sangha. If a person would come along and say there is no Buddha, Dhamma or Sangha, and threatened to kill him if he did not agree, the stream enterer will not budge...he rather die. Stream enterers are not like worldlings who are dirt cheap abundant in the triple world. Besides they are unlikely to advertise "I am a stream enterer, know this" First we must get our facts right about Sotapannas, true ariyas.....so how common are stream enterers?

PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby PeterB » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:38 pm

and you know this how, vesuyal ?

Nyana
Posts: 2233
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:56 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby Nyana » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:43 pm


User avatar
dhamma_spoon
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 2:12 pm

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby dhamma_spoon » Sun Aug 15, 2010 3:07 pm


Shonin
Posts: 583
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:11 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby Shonin » Sun Aug 15, 2010 3:15 pm

I may be wrong but I suspect that stream entry was originally a fairly preliminary 'attainment' gained upon the first real insight into Anatta. In modern Theravada it seems to have been built up into something rather rare and remarkable.

User avatar
Sobeh
Posts: 329
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:35 am
Location: Salt Lake City, UT, US
Contact:

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby Sobeh » Sun Aug 15, 2010 3:19 pm


PeterB
Posts: 3909
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby PeterB » Sun Aug 15, 2010 4:01 pm

As the late Christmas Humphreys , the founder of the London Society once said as he prepared to have a discussion with a newly arrived Buddhist teacher....." Just orf to talk to this chap..see what his take is. I dare say it will be seven of this and fifteen of that...."

User avatar
AdvaitaJ
Posts: 234
Joined: Sat Jan 24, 2009 1:17 am
Location: Michigan, USA

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby AdvaitaJ » Sun Aug 15, 2010 4:34 pm

The birds have vanished down the sky. Now the last cloud drains away.
We sit together, the mountain and me, until only the mountain remains.
Li Bai

User avatar
dhamma_spoon
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 2:12 pm

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby dhamma_spoon » Sun Aug 15, 2010 5:10 pm


Shonin
Posts: 583
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:11 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby Shonin » Sun Aug 15, 2010 7:17 pm


Anicca
Posts: 393
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:11 am
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby Anicca » Sun Aug 15, 2010 7:29 pm


Shonin
Posts: 583
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:11 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby Shonin » Sun Aug 15, 2010 7:41 pm


User avatar
tiltbillings
Posts: 23012
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:25 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby tiltbillings » Sun Aug 15, 2010 8:13 pm


User avatar
tiltbillings
Posts: 23012
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:25 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby tiltbillings » Sun Aug 15, 2010 8:25 pm


lojong1
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:59 am

Re: How common is stream entry?

Postby lojong1 » Sun Aug 15, 2010 8:40 pm

I've only met one person I trusted who thought he might be a sotapanna. He told me you should not slack off, even if you think you're a sotapanna.


Return to “General Theravāda discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 52 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine

cron