Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

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d.sullivan
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Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby d.sullivan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:30 am

Every blade in the field,
Every leaf in the forest,
Lays down its life in its season,
As beautifully as it was taken up.

Thoreau.

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Sobeh
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby Sobeh » Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:46 am

He doesn't even say the word jhana, and yet still he understands that vipassana and samatha are--only together--sammasamadhi. Beyond this he seems to be critiquing the "be here now" sorts of meditations that I see in Zen and New Age seminars everywhere.

There are all sorts of little points I'd quibble with him on, but overall I do not get an impression of a specific vipassana attack.

alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:31 am

Thanks d.sullivan. Thought that article made many important points. If it is a broadside against Vipassana centers then let it be read by all.
I especially liked his critique of "bare attention" as the end-all of meditation.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:49 am


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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:59 am

Bare attention in and of itself strikes me as dry and kind of pointless. People with psychological problems might benefit, I suppose. I like the way the author emphasizes effort and attitude.

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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:03 am

Sati as the opposite of forgetfulness is also good.

Sometimes I think we should just drop "mindfulness" as a word. It just carries too many other implications to be of much value. It's become a one-word tradition.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:06 am


alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:12 am

At a retreat, and as taught by Vipassana books.

Just sitting there paying bare attention seemed liked being charged with the task of picking up little pebbles for the point of making small piles of pebbles.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:17 am


alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:28 am

Good question. Maybe my inability to get how "bare awareness" has any value led to to abandon that type of practice. I'd refer you to paragraph 4 in the article we are discussing.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:35 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:37 am


alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:49 am

Yep, that would be it.
Fire away!
Tell us why it is wrong.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:52 am


alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:07 am

Many meditation teachers preach the idea that to pay attention is enough. "Watch what arises and don't judge it" seems to be the dominant ethos. Scores of books echo this.
If 'mindfulness" has become a one-word path, then "bare-attention" is it's aim. I'm waiting for a cogent explanation of the value of this path.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:15 am


alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:20 am

Go into any general bookstore! I'm sure you know what I mean.
But our subject is sadly neglected.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:24 am


alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby alan » Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:28 am

I'll just retreat from this so as to avoid any unnecessary bad feelings. That way we can both wrap it up and let others take over if they choose.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:41 am



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