Monks in private jets pass test

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Monks in private jets pass test

Postby plwk » Tue Jun 18, 2013 3:02 pm

Image

The National Office of Buddhism insists monks boarding a private jet, wearing sunglasses and using luxury items is not a serious breach of monastic rules, but it is inappropriate.
Read more here
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby daimond » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:15 pm

well, this nothing you would read latter in new like "time magazine" a bhikku carry a gun.
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby manas » Mon Jul 01, 2013 1:31 am

Would it be safe to regard the prohibition against riding in a chariot (and thus an aeroplane which is even more opulent) as a 'minor rule' which, while appropriate for the Buddha's time, can now be dispensed with (and is regularly dispensed with by even very strict monks, for the purposes of preaching the Dhamma)?

Having said that, a private jet seems to be unnecessary when there are plenty of public ones available. It doesn't create a good impression, seeing that picture. Maybe the rule needs some refashioning for the 21st Century, along the lines of, 'A Bhikkhu should choose, when possible, a less expensive mode of transportation, if such an option exists; and such travel in a vehicle should have a purpose that is in accord with the Dhamma' (so not only preaching, but visiting a sick parent who is overseas would be in line with Dhamma, one would think). :?:

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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby BlackBird » Mon Jul 01, 2013 1:51 am

A picture speaks a thousand words.
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby Ben » Mon Jul 01, 2013 4:05 am

Yes, Jack, a picture can speak a thousand words.
Hence, it is important to treat any photograph removed from important contexts with due caution.
kind regards,

Ben
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725


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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby BlackBird » Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:16 am

Ben wrote:Yes, Jack, a picture can speak a thousand words.
Hence, it is important to treat any photograph removed from important contexts with due caution.
kind regards,

Ben


Hi Ben

What contexts can you imagine that could vindicate monks who are flying in a private jet sporting luxury sunglasses, with headphones on? I cannot imagine one. It's one of those cut and dry situations in my mind. But then my mind is far from perfect.

I mean no disrespect, but I don't think there's any need to be cautious in saying that the Buddha would have categorically condemned such luxury for his Bhikkhus. It's a sad state of affairs, but something that is becoming more and more common, and I think it's very wholesome that this picture has sparked a serious debate in Thailand about what is acceptable conduct from monks. The laity have since the Buddha's time acted as a safety valve in holding monks actions to account, indeed many of the vinaya laws were formulated because the laity complained to the Buddha about certain Bhikkhu's behaviour. I believe that it is for the good of the sasana as a whole that such debates occur and that where monks have acted in ways that run against the Buddha's teachings, that they should be condemned for such actions.

That's just how I feel about it anyway.

with metta
Jack

P.S.

Here's the video that the picture comes from, perhaps it can provide more context.
Last edited by BlackBird on Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:26 am, edited 2 times in total.
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby Dan74 » Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:23 am

To me these monks and the story look pretty suss, but I am not sure about the emphasis on all the corruption here lately. I hope it goes somewhere constructive, because otherwise it's just negativity that fosters corrosive doubt and undermines dedication to practice.
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby binocular » Mon Jul 01, 2013 10:20 am

Dan74 wrote:but I am not sure about the emphasis on all the corruption here lately.

Ah, that's just an expression of the critic's obvious superiority. :pig:
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby binocular » Mon Jul 01, 2013 10:24 am

plwk wrote:Image

Next time, someone needs to make a video, one in slo-mo, where the monks walk slowly and dramatically toward the camera, while behind them, there are fires and general havoc. The monks in the pciture above already have the appropriate look on the face, now they only need to get their bodies in sync with the whole drama of the scene.
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby nekete » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:53 am

Different ways of travelling.

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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby tiltbillings » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:13 am

I would guess that these a couple of rich guys who are doing a temporary ordination for merit, probably for a parent or some such thing.

When I was in Bangkok in the mid 70's there was a police official who was doing a temporary ordination for merit for his mother. While he was at the vihara he had a collection of porn so that he could have a stiffy every day, as everyone knows if you do not have a stiffy everyday one looses the ability to have a stiffy.
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby Ben » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:20 am

tiltbillings wrote:as everyone knows if you do not have a stiffy everyday one looses the ability to have a stiffy.


Really? I never heard of that before.
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725


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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby Mr Man » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:20 am

And how about contrived shots of monks meditating in the wilderness or at places of outstanding beauty or attending conferences or touring the pilgrimage sites (or tourist sites). What do we all feel is acceptable?
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby nekete » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:31 am

What does 'stiffy' mean? I have try to translate it with google translator but there is no translation. Is it a slang word?
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby tiltbillings » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:38 am

nekete wrote:What does 'stiffy' mean? I have try to translate it with google translator but there is no translation. Is it a slang word?
Erection of the male member. I am so tempted to run through a list of other slang words, but I'll restrain myself, since I would not want offend anyone's delicate sensibilities.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby nekete » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:51 am

tiltbillings wrote:
nekete wrote:What does 'stiffy' mean? I have try to translate it with google translator but there is no translation. Is it a slang word?
Erection of the male member. I am so tempted to run through a list of other slang words, but I'll restrain myself, since I would not want offend anyone's delicate sensibilities.


Ok, thank you. An erection. I thought it was something 'sexual' because of the porn you said.

I see now that I have written 'I have try' when I should have written 'I have tried'. Ok, I'm learning, I'm learning.
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby BlackBird » Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:04 pm

Haha this makes for a hilarious english as a second language moment.
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby binocular » Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:42 pm

tiltbillings wrote:I would guess that these a couple of rich guys who are doing a temporary ordination for merit, probably for a parent or some such thing.

And as such, their parents arrange means of transportation etc.?
Good point.
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby Mr Man » Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:12 pm

binocular wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:I would guess that these a couple of rich guys who are doing a temporary ordination for merit, probably for a parent or some such thing.

And as such, their parents arrange means of transportation etc.?
Good point.


I believe that one of the monks is Luang Pu Nenkham of Wat Pa Khanti Dhamma
http://en.luangpunenkham.com
Amlo asked to investigate monk
http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/356980/groups-call-for-investigation-on-luang-pu-nen-kham-chattiko
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Re: Monks in private jets pass test

Postby BlackBird » Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:25 pm

Mr Man wrote:
binocular wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:I would guess that these a couple of rich guys who are doing a temporary ordination for merit, probably for a parent or some such thing.

And as such, their parents arrange means of transportation etc.?
Good point.


I believe that one of the monks is Luang Pu Nenkham of Wat Pa Khanti Dhamma
http://en.luangpunenkham.com
Amlo asked to investigate monk
http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/356980/groups-call-for-investigation-on-luang-pu-nen-kham-chattiko


Great news. Safety valve in action.
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
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