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Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality - Page 2 - Dhamma Wheel

Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
Judai
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Judai » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:21 pm


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ancientbuddhism
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby ancientbuddhism » Wed Jun 26, 2013 5:45 pm

Judai, “…to be brutally honest…”, you haven’t the fund of knowledge to engage in these discussions.
I say, beware of all enterprises that require new clothes, and not rather a new wearer of clothes.” – Henry David Thoreau, Walden, 1854

Secure your own mask before assisting others. – NORTHWEST AIRLINES (Pre-Flight Instruction)


huanvuong
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby huanvuong » Wed Jun 26, 2013 5:46 pm

In Buddhism buddha nature has many names, and depend on what Buddha was talking about, he liked to give it different names. Names such as Buddha nature, Boddhi mind, ultimate mind, pure mind, pure awareness, ultimate reality, bare knowingness, emptiness, no mind are some of the words that point directly at the Awaken. In the beginning of Buddha's teaching he never talked about this mind. For him it is important that people learned to let go. Anything that our thinking mind can grasp at, is a defect on the path of enlightenment. Therefore Buddha wanted people to let go. "To let go" does not mean to reject, but to have a relax relation to whatever it is.

Buddha was actually a very clever man and a good teacher. His knowledge was divided into three periods of teaching. The first period is called "The first turning of the wheel". During this first period he stated that life contained suffering. There is a way out of suffering, and the path to end suffering. Actually during this time he never really talked about what Buddha nature is. The goal of this teaching was to reach Nirvana, the end of suffering.

In the "Second turning of the wheel" he talked about the inherit aspect of every phenomena. During this period he talked much about Emptiness, emptiness of self, of no-self, of suffering, of duality...ect. In short everything is egoless. Nothing can exist by its own. It needs everything else in order to come into existence. Even if it seems to come into existence, it is never really there. It is only a vast emptiness display as a magical illusion before our eyes/senses. From this teaching the sutra Prajnaparamita came into the world. During this time whoever encountered Buddha was influenced by his talk about egolessness and his knowledge of Emptiness. In this period he stated, there is no enlightenment nor end of enlightenment. There is no Nirvana, no Samsara, no ignorance nor end of ignorance. Everything was just a vast Emptiness!

People who did not understood him thought, there was nothing at all. They thought everything was just a great blank and void nothingness, but this was not the case. Buddha didn't mean that there was absolutely nothing. Many people - still today - have misunderstood this aspect of Buddha's teaching. To believe there is absolutely nothing then who is it that seemingly live in this physical body?

So because Buddha was concerned that a number of people misunderstood his teaching and hold on that nothing - absolutely nothing - exist then he did the "Third turning of the wheel". During this period he pointed directly at the mind and said within Emptiness something seems to be there. It is not a thing, a subject, a object but a mere Knowingness, Pure Awareness; Buddha mind. It does not belong to anyone, it is not a self, not a body, not a thought. It is pure beyond the concept of being born and not born. It is the Knower without anyone who knows. It is the Witness without anyone witnessing. It is beyond words or any conceptual construct. It has always been there, but if we try to find it (as an object to identify) we have missed the point, have not understood the teaching. It has the capacity to know itself, know about its presence, but it can never look at it, because it is not an object, a subject or any sensory phenomena.

This marked the last teaching of the Buddha. Just before he died, he said "Take my dharma as your light. Walk the path and exam my words!". :anjali:

huanvuong
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby huanvuong » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:09 pm

So far we know, the sutras were written long after Buddha had entered Nirvana. Today no one really knows with 100% what Buddha said or did not say. There is no deal in making a big quarrel out of that. We just need to use our common sense and exam Buddha's words. Throw away what cannot be used. Collect them up later if they seem to be true! We must be our own light just as the Buddha said before he died.

Judai
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Judai » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:19 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:48 pm


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Ben
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Ben » Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:29 pm

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

Judai
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Judai » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:16 pm


Judai
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Judai » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:23 pm


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Ben
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Ben » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:31 pm

Actually your dating discussion is off topic.

And no, AncientBuddhism's comment is not an ad hominem.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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tiltbillings
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:48 pm


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tiltbillings
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:52 pm


Judai
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Judai » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:53 pm


Judai
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Judai » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:56 pm

as I said BOTH the Pali canon and Mahayana sutras are found in the Gandhara scrolls

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tiltbillings
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:25 am


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Gaoxing
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Re: Advaitin vs. Buddhist takes on awareness/reality

Postby Gaoxing » Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:03 am

Having read the Suttas the Buddha does not say No-self is suffering. The Buddha said self is suffering and this self and any idea of self or independent entities are only a construct of the Skandha. There can neither be self in any of the aggregates. What makes the self appear is clinging to it and also any other concept of independent entity. Dependent origination negates the possibility of any entity that is a self.

The Buddha equates existence with suffering and self. Once existence is eliminated the threshold of Nirvana is gained. Who sees dependent origination sees the Damma and who sees the Damma sees the Buddha. Beyond the damma there is no Buddha and no self and no suffering.

The twelve components of dependent origination are the three categories of afflictions, actions and suffering. Past, present and future. These again are nothing but ignorance, craving and clinging causing the delusion of existence causing suffering. The twelve components are 1) ignorance 2) volition 3) consciousness 4) name and form 5) Six senses 6) contact 7) feeling 8) craving 9) clinging 10) becoming 11) birth 12) death


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