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Should sex be demonized so much? - Page 3 - Dhamma Wheel

Should sex be demonized so much?

A place to discuss health and fitness, healthy diets. A fit body makes for a fit mind.
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Hanzze
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Location: Cambodia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:21 am

One is just able to compair his own experianses (which requires to remember) while argue with what other told does not make sense as long as one does not prove it amoung him self. Only here there is the possibility to gain understanding. Using tellings of elders and wise as a frame of compairing is how ever useful, but no need to addopt it without a own prove.
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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manas
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby manas » Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:40 am

I appreciate all the replies.

I wish to comment on something. (Sorry for my lack of intellectual or should I say scholarly vigour at present. I have no more Internet or even computer at home anymore, and so have to do this from my local library, where I feel surrounded not just by other people (not that they are looking over my shoulder, but still...) but also where being immersed in wi-fi EMF fields is making me feel a bit dizzy right now).

At the moment of orgasm, the 'animal' aspect of our nature wants to push that energy outwards, downwards. To resist this urge and retain the semen in the body, drawing the energy inwards & upwards instead is actually reversing this usual course of events. It requires much self control, a certain measure of detachment and a lot of awareness of mind and body.

I agree with the member who said is needs to be done with the right instruction. There are a few masters around but one needs to be careful to find a properly qualified one. As this is a forum for the Buddha-Dhamma, which represents truths higher and more sublime than merely learning how to recirculate energy and thus live a longer and much healthier life, I hesitated to mention where I am getting this information from, but so long as no one thinks I am advertising, it is from Mantak Chia, a Taoist Master. He teaches this art in a completely non-religious way, by the way - he is actually a Christian by faith. It's just about energy. Anyone can learn to do it, religion doesn't come into it.

One thing I read was that one must not misuse the sexual power one can gain from this practice. It is intended to save the vital forces and recirculate them so that this energy can be put to good use, ultimately making one not just healthier but also a more loving partner to one's wife and a more helpful member of society. If one goes about having insubstantial relationships based upon sex alone, using women and abandoning them like a commodity, that is a misuse of the art, according to Chia. Maybe that is why it was traditionally not taught widely, but only to a few selected persons.

The truths of impermance and self-less-ness of all phenomena (in the sense of the upanishadic 'atman') are still much more earth-shattering than this, but I wanted to share how freeing it is to be letting go of the guilt and shame regarding sexual pleasure. I know it is impermanent and not-self. It is just feeling, it comes and goes. But somehow I feel as though a huge burden has been lifted from me. I am no longer at war with myself. Sex is not sinful, it is just a force of Nature. But one should know how to engage in it for one's benefit, rather than for one's harm and depletion. That is what Taoist sexual practices are for.

And regarding that warning someone gave about 'danger', as I said the only danger is if one misuses the powers that one can gain over time, having one-night stands etc (a moral danger). But that is caused by the person, not by the practice. There is no physical danger from retaining the seed. There can be some discomfort if one does it incorrectly, but not danger.

metta.
Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

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Ben
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Ben » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:06 am

Thanks Manas.
Sorry to hear that you have no computer at home any more.
As for WiFi EMS - they are everywhere and you've been basking in the radiance of similar electro-magnetic radiation since you were conceived. Your lightheadedness, I would hazzard to guess, is probably due to something much more gross - food, fluid intake, air, any chronic conditions you have. Anyway, that is by the by.
As for the Taoist approach to reticulating the sexual energy...
Having had some involvement for a few years with the shinto/taoist influenced teacher of macrobiotics, shiatsu and aikido from my distant past, I can assure you that I have not looked back since taking Dhamma seriously. "Working" with sexual drive whether it be through Taoist practice, kundalini or Tantra, can just be an elaborate form of indulging/grasping/craving.
If you really want to learn how to deal with your craving as well as your aversion effectively, then I cannot recommend highly enough regular residential retreats of vipassana meditation supported by ongoing practice in daily life.
kind regards,

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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manas
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby manas » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:20 am

Hi Ben,

I did say at the outset that this topic was for laymen who are not (as yet) willing or able to renounce sex pleasure. Of course there will be a measure of 'grasping' as one experiences pleasure rise upward, rather than spurting it out wastefully into the abyss. But that grasping is going to be there in any case. It doesn't disappear until anagami, right? So until then, if one is a layman, and is not yet going to be celibate, then this is a useful *adjunct* to one's Buddhist practice. It is not Enlightenment, but it is on a much higher level than ordinary, animalistic ejaculatory sex. It is a step in the right direction, towards greater self-control and awareness. I never said it could replace the Dhamma though, did I?

kind regards. _/I\_
Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

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tiltbillings
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:25 am


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manas
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby manas » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:28 am

Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

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tiltbillings
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:32 am


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Ben
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Ben » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:38 am

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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manas
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Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby manas » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:47 am

Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

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manas
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Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 3:04 am
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby manas » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:57 am

Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

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Hanzze
Posts: 1906
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Cambodia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:06 am

The practice starts with observing silas and no way around it (sure some might argue with Dana, and even argue that they make Dana in that way, which might be a possibility to start...) Everything else might be a nice hobby but does not lead anywhere else as one is. The dendency is the first one needs to ajust. If one tends to seach for excuses to walk on, he can nothing but increase his stress.
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Hanzze
Posts: 1906
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Location: Cambodia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:12 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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ground
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby ground » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:49 am


Mawkish1983
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Mawkish1983 » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:02 am

Last edited by Mawkish1983 on Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Ben
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Ben » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:07 am

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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mikenz66
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Location: New Zealand

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby mikenz66 » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:21 am


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Hanzze
Posts: 1906
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Cambodia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:23 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

User avatar
Ben
Posts: 18442
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: kanamaluka

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Ben » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:37 am

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

User avatar
Hanzze
Posts: 1906
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Cambodia

Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Hanzze » Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:02 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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Dan74
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Re: Should sex be demonized so much?

Postby Dan74 » Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:26 am

I think sometimes a sidestep can be useful, but sometimes it could be the first step in the wrong direction.

For instance, some energy work like yoga and qi gong can help bring about mental states which are much more receptive to the Dhamma and practice especially when people have deeply ingrained energetic patterns than interfere with practice, like very intense excitation, anxious, obsessive disposition, etc.

I've heard in Vajrayana they spend a lot of time of energy work, "channels", "winds" etc. Which in itself is no more or less Buddhadhamma that the various preparatory practices we do in all traditions, like scanning before anapanasati, I think.

I don't know if reading books on Taoism is a useful sidestep or a step in the wrong direction, but I certainly think that Ben's advice to do a solid retreat, is a bloody good idea. If a 10-day is too long, or Vipassana is not your thing, there are other options around. Just yesterday I met Christine Thompson, who is a very experienced teacher and a long-term practitioner in IMS style, who has a centre down your way, I believe. They have evening sits and day retreats and she would be a very good person to talk to, I think.

_/|\_


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