Ordination in Thailand

Discussion of ordination, the Vinaya and monastic life. How and where to ordain? Bhikkhuni ordination etc.

Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby gavesako » Fri Apr 16, 2010 7:05 am

Here is the whole ordination procedure in Pali:

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... .app2.html
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby fabianfred » Sat Sep 04, 2010 6:19 am

I have been living here in Thailand for the past eighteen years since retirement from the British Army at age 40.
I moved to Fang from Chiangmai 12 years ago after getting married to a local girl and we have two children. Since than I have been on the Non-immigrant 'O' married extension of stay yearly.

I ordained as a novice in Wat SriBunRuang Fang on the 9th May. I have been coming to the temple almost daily to teach the Dhamma and Meditation to foreigners who attend the MonkforaMonth project (Facebook= Monk for a month or my Facebook= Fabian Frederick Blandford).
I ordained as a monk on 21st july just before the start of the three months rains retreat.
Upon being advised that I could get a change to non-Immigrant 'R' one year extension of stay by taking a letter from the abbot to the national Office of Buddhism, Buddhamonthon, Nakorn Phrathom, and getting a letter from them.....which I would show to immigration... I went.

People know where the general area of buddhamonthon is...but not the actual place....so best to get a taxi. The actual office is a long walk from the main road if you take the bus.
My documantation was not complete...so I couldn't get the letter. They advised me as to which forms I needed filled in and signed...by the abbot, head monk of the district, and head monk of the province. I already was in possesion of the 'bai Suttee' which is the passport which all monks and novices carry.
Back to my temple and running around getting the signatures. They had given me an addressed envelope to send back to their office by EMS....which I did.
The wait for it to return....I was getting very close to the deadline when my visa would expire..on the 5th of this month...so they sent it direct to the Chiangmai immigration office.
Yesterday I went early......always a queue anyway. I eventually got my visa changed and a new one year extension of stay. cost 1900 Baht...plus about 3000 Baht more running about and down to BKK etc. (who says monks don't need money!!??)
advice...start a month before your visa expires.... if you enjoy walking, the grounds at buddhamonthon are extensive and have varieties of wildlife which seem very tame and easy to photograph.

from next year I shall be able to do the paperwork at the Religious headquarters in Chiangmai instead of going to BKK.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby pilgrim » Sat Sep 04, 2010 7:56 am

Congratulations Fabian...I keep myself updated about MFAM at Facebook. Good job up there. :anjali:
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby sonictravels » Fri Sep 10, 2010 1:15 am

Hello,

Does anyone have any information about Wat Tha Ma O? I cannot locate a website which may suggest it wouldn't be easy to ordain there as an english speaker..

Thanks
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby yuttadhammo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:11 am

fabianfred wrote:from next year I shall be able to do the paperwork at the Religious headquarters in Chiangmai instead of going to BKK.
Word to the wise... don't. You will find a world of difference between Chiang Mai and Buddhamonton. Trust me. Stick with Buddhamonton and be happy at spending only 3000 on transportation. I spent a month trying to get an extension to my R visa and on the day my visa was set to expire I went in and asked if they could rush it. They asked me why I waited until the last day. Unless you have powerful friends or lots of "tea money" (เงินชา) expect problems at every turn. When my friend sent her application to Buddhamonton, poof, her problems disappeared. In fact, if you talk to them nicely, you can just send stuff to BM by mail and not have to go yourself.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby yuttadhammo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:16 am

sonictravels wrote:Does anyone have any information about Wat Tha Ma O? I cannot locate a website which may suggest it wouldn't be easy to ordain there as an english speaker..

If you are referring to the Burmese Pali center in the North, Talk to the monks at Section 25 in Wat Mahadhatu, BKK. They are connected. I hear it has a new abbot who is not as disciplined as the last. Just hearsay, though.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby sonictravels » Fri Sep 10, 2010 4:10 pm

yuttadhammo wrote:
sonictravels wrote:Does anyone have any information about Wat Tha Ma O? I cannot locate a website which may suggest it wouldn't be easy to ordain there as an english speaker..

If you are referring to the Burmese Pali center in the North, Talk to the monks at Section 25 in Wat Mahadhatu, BKK. They are connected. I hear it has a new abbot who is not as disciplined as the last. Just hearsay, though.


Well, earlier in the thread, there was a quote from Ven. Dhammanando Bhikkh suggesting it as a good place. I am trying to find somewhere that would offer a good training in Vinaya, Dhamma, and meditation. Does anyone have any opinions about Wat Pah Nanachat in regards to those criteria? As much as I would like to experience the kind of dedication and support as that of the lay communities in Thailand, I am beginning to think that I might get more out of a relatively quieter monastery back here in England such as Cittaviveka.

Anyway, thank you Yuttadhammo.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby yuttadhammo » Fri Sep 10, 2010 4:49 pm

sonictravels wrote:Well, earlier in the thread, there was a quote from Ven. Dhammanando Bhikkh suggesting it as a good place.

Sorry, I'd not read the entire thread, but that makes it certain to be the same place. Ven Dhammanando is wise in these things, but I imagine most foreigners would prefer an easy place like Wat Pa Nanachat over an exotic experience like Wat Tam Ma Oh. They are mostly well known for their Pali studies, I think. A better place from what I've seen would be Wat Jaak Dang in Samutprakan; they teach vinaya from the pitaka and recite pieces of the patimokkha during evening chanting. They also teach abhidhamma and Pali - the vice abbot is a very well-known Pali scholar and the abbot well-known for abhidhamma. For meditation teaching you might have to look elsewhere, though.
I am trying to find somewhere that would offer a good training in Vinaya, Dhamma, and meditation. Does anyone have any opinions about Wat Pah Nanachat in regards to those criteria? As much as I would like to experience the kind of dedication and support as that of the lay communities in Thailand, I am beginning to think that I might get more out of a relatively quieter monastery back here in England such as Cittaviveka.

Anyway, thank you Yuttadhammo.

You're welcome; personally, I would recommend a place in England over moving to Thailand, unless you have a Thai passport.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby appicchato » Sat Sep 11, 2010 12:15 am

...unless you have a Thai passport.

Not to contradict, or dispute, but a Thai passport is not necessary…for a foreign national any will suffice...
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby yuttadhammo » Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:35 pm

appicchato wrote:
...unless you have a Thai passport.

Not to contradict, or dispute, but a Thai passport is not necessary…for a foreign national any will suffice...
Maybe my situation was unique, then :) On the other hand, Dhammanando himself has been forced to leave the country, as I understand... maybe he agrees with me.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby appicchato » Sun Sep 12, 2010 12:12 am

yuttadhammo wrote:...Dhammanando himself has been forced to leave the country, as I understand... maybe he agrees with me.

Greetings Bhante,

Foreign born monks basically have two options to stay in Thailand…a religious visa, or a student visa, both one year, both requiring renewal each year…the Thai government puts a limit of nine renewals on religious visas…if I had to venture a guess, I would say that Dhammanando Bhikkhu exhausted his ten years (or more, this being Thailand), and chose not to become a student…Thai passports are not on the cards for foreign born nationals…

Be well...
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby sonictravels » Fri Sep 17, 2010 9:08 pm

Thanks for all the information. I had a lovely stay in Cittaviveka. Everyone was warm and most importantly it seems to have potential for serious practice. It was also absolutely beautiful and so I feel that I don't need to look any further. But I am still tempted to go to Thailand. Only time will tell. Now I just need to practice patience to see how the path will unfold for me.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby FBM » Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:45 am

sonictravels wrote:Hello,

Does anyone have any information about Wat Tha Ma O? I cannot locate a website which may suggest it wouldn't be easy to ordain there as an english speaker..

Thanks


http://www.wattamaoh.com/home/index.php

I spent a week at Wat Tammahoh. It's Burmese, not Thai. I asked about ordination and they said it wouldn't be a problem. The Ajahn is very old (if he's still alive) and doesn't speak English, but the head monk does quite well.

The main function of Wat Tamaoh is to teach Pali to monks getting ready to take the state Pali exams. Most of the monks I saw there were young Burmese kids. It's a nice place, kinda small and in the suburbs of Lampang. The morning pindabat isn't hard, and it's a quiet neighborhood. I was there about 4 years ago, and they didn't have Internet access at that time. They do have a library with a limited, but interesting, selection of English books.

If I ordain a second time, Wat Tamaoh tops my (current) list of places to go. After you have settled in and learned how to behave as a monk, you can get permission to spend vassa at forest monasteries, if that's your inclination. If I were to go back, I'd ordain there and then go to the International Buddhist College in Sanklaburi for Ph.D studies.

The wat has English and Thai language classes for the young monks, too. As of four years ago, a Thai woman taught them both languages. If I were to ordain there, I'd volunteer to teach English to the other monks. The young ones are mostly very poor refugees who ordained as a means to get an education, food, shelter, etc. They're well supported by the local Thais, and the wat has a very good reputation. When I was trying to find it, all I had to say was "Wat Tamaoh" and everybody I talked to quickly pointed me in the right direction.

Best of luck!
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby gavesako » Fri Jun 17, 2011 5:22 pm

For those who are looking for this information:

Somdet Maha Samanachao Vajirananavarorasa - Ordination Procedure

http://www.scribd.com/doc/30162231/Bhik ... -Procedure
Bhikkhu Gavesako
Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

ajahnchah.org - Teachings of Ajahn Chah in many languages
Dhammatube - Videos on Buddhist practice
Ancient Buddhist Texts - Translations and history of Pali texts
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby FBM » Sat Jun 18, 2011 11:15 am

gavesako wrote:For those who are looking for this information:

Somdet Maha Samanachao Vajirananavarorasa - Ordination Procedure

http://www.scribd.com/doc/30162231/Bhik ... -Procedure


:anjali: Thank you for that. It brings up fond memories. Incidentally, the Ajahn at Wat Sunan was/is Japanese and named Gavesako. I presume he is still there. :anjali:
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby gavesako » Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:42 am

Bhikkhu Gavesako: Life as a Buddhist Monk in the West (video)

Posted by Anandajoti on Sunday, 19th June, 2011

This talk was given by Bhikkhu Gavesako on January 8th 2010, shortly before I left the Bodhi Lankarama Temple in Taiping to take up residence in Vivekavana (Malaysia).

In the talk Bhante describes the history of the Western Sangha, which originated with Ajahn Chah in north-east Thailand and then spread around the world starting with England in 1979.

There were many challenges and obstacles that had to be faced, and some adaptations to the new environment had to be made.

Having forest monasteries established in the West enabled young spiritual seekers to ordain as Buddhist monks there rather than in Asia, but the process of finding the appropriate monastic structure for the West still continues.

http://records.photodharma.net/talks/bh ... n-the-west
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Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby gavesako » Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:49 am

Here you can find the Ordination (upasampada) Pali chanting with Thai explanation as sound files, for anyone wanting to become a monk in Thailand:

http://www.luangphee.co.cc/2011/01/monk.html
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby gavesako » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:13 am

Upajjhaya Appointments

Luang Por Liem receiving the authorisation for Ajahn Amaro and Ajahn Chandapalo to perform Upasampada from a Tan Chao Khun at Wat Saket, Bangkok

This week, Ajahn Amaro and Ajahn Chandapalo were granted the status of upajjhaya (preceptor) by the Mahathera Samakorn, the ecclesiastical body which governs the Thai sangha, of which we are a part. Luang Por Liem came to Bangkok from Wat Pah Pong in the North East of Thailand to receive the certificates, and Ajahns Amaro and Chandapalo will fly to Thailand later this week to collect them in person before returning only a few days later. The sangha here will offer their respects and appreciation and endorse this appointment at a gathering at CBM on 10th June, when Samanera Bodhinando's Bhikkhu ordination can now go ahead, along with 4 other candidates.

http://ratanagiri.org.uk/index.php?opti ... &Itemid=72

(These days the Sangha is divided into many "nikayas" or sub-groups with their own ecclesiastical structure which appoints only certain senior monks as "preceptors", i.e. those entitled to ordain new monks. Western monks of the Ajahn Chah tradition belong to the Thai Mahanikaya group and have to follow this procedure as well in order for the ordained monks to be recognized in Thailand.)
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby Anagarika » Thu Nov 03, 2011 3:42 am

For those inquiring about temporary novice (samanera) ordination in Thailand, may I recommend the following:

http://www.monkordination.com

Dr. Apisit is the Abbot of Wat Sri Boen Ruang in Fang, Chiang Mai region, Thailand, and he supervises the teaching and permitting of novice ordinations for western men who qualify. Dr. Apisit is a young, dynamic Abbot and he is assisted by Phra Fred and Phra Greg, both English speaking Bhikkhus who teach Dhamma and Vipassana well.

Many men, young and older, have migrated to WSBR for temporary ordination and found the experience, the Monks and lay people, and the beauty of the region, extraordinary.

I ordained as a samanera in the summer of 2010 after a period of time in study and practice before the Rains. I was fortunate to be permitted by Dr. Apisit to do so, as my Pali was less than complete during the ordination, but I was ordained. An experience that I cannot adequately describe. You would need to experience it yourself. Highly recommended.
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Re: Ordination in Thailand

Postby Beneath the Wheel » Thu Nov 03, 2011 9:52 pm

Is it possible to receive long-term ordination at Wat Sri Boen Ruang? Or do they only do temporary ordinations?

Also is there any sort of school or classes where one could learn Thai in that area?
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