especially if they are focused solely on one specific method! the buddha taught so many it's amazing. and he gave a fair amount of variation on many of the individual methods as well. so when someone says "the only way is MY way and it's this specific training taught by the buddha", i'm kind of like "...hmmm... i'm going to just back up and leave quietly."mikenz66 wrote:My solution is to simply ignore anyone who claims to have the one true method or the one true interpretation of the Buddha-Vacana.alan... wrote: i like that attitude. considering how great each method has worked for me, to right one or another off as "wrong" seems like a bad idea. although some who teach these methods would certainly call theirs the only right ones...
However, I would advise following the suggestions of one particular teacher. Different teachers can sound contradictory because they are trying to give what they think is the most effective way of approaching the path, based on their experience, and the experience of their students.
Mike
Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
As per Sylvester's comment,
I can relate to the sign of light.
Can anyone related to the sign of form?
Give some details please.
I can relate to the sign of light.
Can anyone related to the sign of form?
Give some details please.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
While we are in this discussion, I like to point out some thing which we did not mention in this forum.
According to Suttas, prince Siddhartha has seen four Nimittas before he left his home.
-Old person, sick person, dead body and a monk (Four Nimittas)
- These Nimittas are related to (I think), Anicca (impermanence), Dukkha, Anatta and Nirvana
-So Nimitta is some thing we see before hand which link to the next outcome.
The most important thing is to grasp the meaning of Nimitta. Otherwise you will miss the point.
For example if I see these four Nimitas, I will not have the same effect as for the prince Siddhartha.
============
In a lighter note, village people in Sri Lanka look for a Nimitta before they do some important task.
Sometimes they bother going to make a deliberate good Nimitta.
For example, if I am going to a job interview my mother will meet me on the way with water filled vesal in her hand
According to Suttas, prince Siddhartha has seen four Nimittas before he left his home.
-Old person, sick person, dead body and a monk (Four Nimittas)
- These Nimittas are related to (I think), Anicca (impermanence), Dukkha, Anatta and Nirvana
-So Nimitta is some thing we see before hand which link to the next outcome.
The most important thing is to grasp the meaning of Nimitta. Otherwise you will miss the point.
For example if I see these four Nimitas, I will not have the same effect as for the prince Siddhartha.
============
In a lighter note, village people in Sri Lanka look for a Nimitta before they do some important task.
Sometimes they bother going to make a deliberate good Nimitta.
For example, if I am going to a job interview my mother will meet me on the way with water filled vesal in her hand
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
It's worth realising that the word nimitta is used in a variety of contexts, not just in reference to concentration. Of course, this would be expected for a word that translates as sign, etc:
http://what-buddha-said.net/library/Bud ... tm#nimitta
Mike
http://what-buddha-said.net/library/Bud ... tm#nimitta
Mike
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
Advice on tactile "nimittas", and how best to use them?SarathW wrote:As per Sylvester's comment,
I can relate to the sign of light.
Can anyone related to the sign of form?
Give some details please.
Mike
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
Thanks mike' it is very helpful.
I understand Tactile Nimitta is referring to the Form Nimitta.
It appears to me with the little experience I have:
Form Nimitta is related to the Rupa aspect and the Light Nimitta is related to the Nama aspect.
I understand Tactile Nimitta is referring to the Form Nimitta.
It appears to me with the little experience I have:
Form Nimitta is related to the Rupa aspect and the Light Nimitta is related to the Nama aspect.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
Just found this old thread. Very interesting. Thanks Mike
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
The word "nimitta" is found 14 times in DN 33 and none appear to be a reference to the ekaggata nimitta of jhana. Sujato translates the above as:mikenz66 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 01, 2013 5:03 am Sign of tranquilty (samathaanimitta)
DN iii 213. DN 33, page 4811.9. ‘There are [sets of] two things that were perfectly proclaimed by the Lord... Which are they?
...
(23) ‘Calm and insight (samatho ca vipassanā ca).
(24) ‘The sign of calm and grasping the sign (samatha-nimittañ ca paggaha-nimittañ ca).
...
The foundation of serenity and the foundation of exertion.
Samathanimittañca paggahanimittañca
paggaha
masculine
exertion; energy; lifting; holding up; support; patronage.
The above is also highly questionable or clutching at straws because the word nimitta is found in the sutta including:mikenz66 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 01, 2013 5:03 amSN v 66. SN 46.2, p1570“And what, bhikkhus, is the nutriment for the arising of the unarisen enlightenment factor of concentration and for the fulfilment by development of the arisen enlightenment factor of concentration? There are, bhikkhus, the sign of serenity, the sign of nondispersal[62] frequently giving careful attention to them is the nutriment for the arising of the unarisen enlightenment factor of concentration and for the fulfilment by development of the arisen enlightenment factor of concentration.
- [62] Spk: The sign of serenity (samathanimitta) is serenity itself as well as its object (Spk-pṭ: the paṭibhāganimitta or counterpart sign); the sign of nondispersal (abyagganimitta) is synonymous with it.
There appears nothing compelling in SN 46.2 to support the conclusion samathanimittaṃ abyagganimittaṃ refer to the ekaggata sign of jhana.There is the feature of beauty (fuels the arising of sensual desire).
Atthi, bhikkhave, subhanimittaṃ.
There is the feature of harshness (fuels the arising of ill will).
Atthi, bhikkhave, paṭighanimittaṃ.
The above appears to be about the development of psychic powers or the Divine Eye of Anuruddha.
Do you see Anuruddha walking meditation together with several mendicants?”
Passatha no tumhe, bhikkhave, anuruddhaṃ sambahulehi bhikkhūhi saddhiṃ caṅkamantan”ti?
“Yes, sir.”
“Evaṃ, bhante”.
“All of those mendicants have clairvoyance.
“Sabbe kho ete, bhikkhave, bhikkhū dibbacakkhukā.
https://suttacentral.net/sn14.15/en/sujato
The above sounds tenuous.mikenz66 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 01, 2013 5:03 amIn his Encyclopaedia entry Ven Analayo notes:
The relation of the nimitta to the development of concentration is also reflected in the expressions sign of tranquilty (samathaanimitta), sign of concentration (samadhinimitta), and sign of the mind (cittanimitta), which occur in serveral instances in the discourses. the development of beneficial types of nimitta is particularly relevant to the beginning stages of samatha meditation.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
Re: Suttas mentioning tranquility and concentration nimittas
It's interesting to look at this a few years on. I think Sylvester's analysis here: https://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.p ... 85#p226785 is helpful, distinguishing causes from results. Assaji's thread here https://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2770 is also very useful.
Mike
Mike