Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Training of Sila, the Five Precepts (Pañcasikkhāpada), and Eightfold Ethical Conduct (Aṭṭhasīla).

Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Hanzze » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:58 am

There is a beautiful tradition in Cambodia (even fading slowly away) and I guess also in other Buddhist countries which do not have much similare traditions in other countries. Its a very Buddhist tradition. Once or more times in while there is a physical relation between child and parents, the child would performe a festival to honor and respect their parents. There would be performences very similar to the sutta below, as well as such occations - through inviting Monks maybe not only for a prayer but for a talk - the possibility to pay father and mother back what they did.

With Brahma

This was said by the Lord...

"Living with Brahma are those families where, within the home, mother and father are respected by their children. Living with the early devas are those families where, within the home, mother and father are respected by their children. Living with the early teachers are those families where, within the home, mother and father are respected by their children. Living with those worthy of adoration are those families where, within the home, mother and father are respected by their children. 'Brahma,' bhikkhus, is a term for mother and father. 'Early devas' and 'early teachers' and 'those worthy of veneration' are terms for mother and father. For what reason? Because mother and father are very helpful to their children, they take care of them and bring them up and teach them about the world."

Mother and father are called
"Brahma," "early teachers"
And "worthy of veneration,"
Being compassionate towards
Their family of children.
Thus the wise should venerate them,
Pay them due honor,
Provide them with food and drink,
Give them clothing and a bed,
Anoint and bathe them
And also wash their feet.
When he performs such service
For his mother and his father,
They praise that wise person even here
And hereafter he rejoices in heaven



I would like to dedicate this topic to my parents and thought to share it also with you as a good place to add some in honor to your parents. Not to forget, after we had understood the meaning of parents, that it was said by the Buddha: "It is not easy to find a being who has not been your mother, your father, your brother, sister, son or daughter."

May I be able, may I do not lose effort, may I find the possibility to pay all this generosity back.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Annapurna » Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:17 am

Jetzt habe ich Tränen in den Augen, lieber Hanzze...

I have had the blessing of the dearest parents any child could have hoped for.
I loved them so much, and love them more now, that they are gone.

If I could turn back the handles of time, I would try to be a better daughter.... They deserved the best and gave their all and everything to their children.

May they be very happy where they are.
http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Hanzze » Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:38 am

They might be still there (different, of maybe not seen), so there is no need to worry that one is not able to be a better child to for them. We can pay back all the time. Nothing lost, but a powerful source for effort.

A really nice book to share with children: Im Schatten der Liebe meiner Eltern (deutsch) as a little present for all parents and children as well.
I have only a german translation as pdf, here online on newbuddist-forum: Under the shadow of my parents love - Our first gods (english/khmer)


In Cambodia, if there is a bigger ordination ceremony, people spend more then one day, just to remember there parents. Much tears, really much tears, but it's very neede to walk on. With much gratidtued one is not weight down, it's actually the opposite. It lightens, having the parents on the right place in ones heart.

much mudita
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Hanzze » Tue Sep 25, 2012 9:25 am

From the talk Your real home, a gift from Ajahn Chah.

Those who nurse the sick grow in goodness and virtue. One who is sick and giving others that opportunity shouldn't make things difficult for them. If there's a pain or some problem or other, let them know, and keep the mind in a wholesome state. One who is nursing parents should fill his or her mind with warmth and kindness, not get caught in aversion. This is the one time when you can repay the debt you owe them. From your birth through your childhood, as you've grown up, you've been dependent on your parents. That we are here today is because our mothers and fathers have helped us in so many ways. We owe them an incredible debt of gratitude.

So today, all of you children and relatives gathered here together, see how your parents become your children. Before, you were their children; now they become yours. They become older and older until they become children again. Their memories go, their eyes don't see so well and their ears don't hear, sometimes they garble their words. Don't let it upset you. All of you nursing the sick must know how to let go. Don't hold on to things, just let go and let them have their own way. When a young child is disobedient, sometimes the parents let it have its own way just to keep the peace, to make it happy. Now your parents are like that child. Their memories and perceptions are confused. Sometimes they muddle up your names, or you ask them to give you a cup and they bring a plate. It's normal, don't be upset by it.

Let the patient remember the kindness of those who nurse and patiently endure the painful feelings. Exert yourself mentally, don't let the mind become scattered and agitated, and don't make things difficult for those looking after you. Let those who nurse the sick fill their minds with virtue and kindness. Don't be averse to the unattractive side of the job, to cleaning up mucus and phlegm, or urine and excrement. Try your best. Everyone in the family give a hand.

These are the only parents you've got. They gave you life, they have been your teachers, your nurses and your doctors — they've been everything to you. That they have brought you up, taught you, shared their wealth with you and made you their heirs is the great beneficence of parents. Consequently the Buddha taught the virtues of kataññu and katavedi, of knowing our debt of gratitude and trying to repay it. These two virtues are complementary. If our parents are in need, if they're unwell or in difficulty, then we do our best to help them. This is kataññu-katavedi, it is a virtue that sustains the world. It prevents families from breaking up, it makes them stable and harmonious.

Today I have brought you the Dhamma as a gift in this time of illness. I have no material things to give you; there seem to be plenty of those in the house already, and so I give you Dhamma, something which has a lasting worth, something which you'll never be able to exhaust. Having received it from me you can pass it on to as many others as you like and it will never be depleted. That is the nature of Truth. I am happy to have been able to give you this gift of Dhamma, and I hope it will give you strength to deal with your pain.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Hanzze » Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:27 am

Tears

At Savatthi. There the Blessed One said: "From an inconstruable beginning comes transmigration. A beginning point is not evident, though beings hindered by ignorance and fettered by craving are transmigrating & wandering on. What do you think, monks: Which is greater, the tears you have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — or the water in the four great oceans?"

"As we understand the Dhamma taught to us by the Blessed One, this is the greater: the tears we have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — not the water in the four great oceans."

"Excellent, monks. Excellent. It is excellent that you thus understand the Dhamma taught by me.

"This is the greater: the tears you have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — not the water in the four great oceans.

"Long have you (repeatedly) experienced the death of a mother. The tears you have shed over the death of a mother while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — are greater than the water in the four great oceans.

"Long have you (repeatedly) experienced the death of a father... the death of a brother... the death of a sister... the death of a son... the death of a daughter... loss with regard to relatives... loss with regard to wealth... loss with regard to disease. The tears you have shed over loss with regard to disease while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — are greater than the water in the four great oceans.

"Why is that? From an inconstruable beginning comes transmigration. A beginning point is not evident, though beings hindered by ignorance and fettered by craving are transmigrating & wandering on. Long have you thus experienced stress, experienced pain, experienced loss, swelling the cemeteries — enough to become disenchanted with all fabricated things, enough to become dispassionate, enough to be released."
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Annapurna » Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:06 am

Hanzze wrote:They might be still there (different, of maybe not seen), so there is no need to worry that one is not able to be a better child to for them. We can pay back all the time. Nothing lost, but a powerful source for effort.

A really nice book to share with children: Im Schatten der Liebe meiner Eltern (deutsch) as a little present for all parents and children as well.
I have only a german translation as pdf, here online on newbuddist-forum: Under the shadow of my parents love - Our first gods (english/khmer)


In Cambodia, if there is a bigger ordination ceremony, people spend more then one day, just to remember there parents. Much tears, really much tears, but it's very neede to walk on. With much gratidtued one is not weight down, it's actually the opposite. It lightens, having the parents on the right place in ones heart.

much mudita


Love-ly, Hanzze...

It made me remember the names my mother had for me..."Herzele" und "Schneckele"...(which are tender, diminuitive forms of a heart and a snail...) maybe that explains why I love snails so much? :smile:

And my Dad often called me "Söte Deern", which is Westfälisches Platt (an old German subtype of language), which means "sweet girl".

Of course I had no idea how good I had it.
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Annapurna » Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:09 am

Hanzze wrote:
Tears

At Savatthi. There the Blessed One said: "From an inconstruable beginning comes transmigration. A beginning point is not evident, though beings hindered by ignorance and fettered by craving are transmigrating & wandering on. What do you think, monks: Which is greater, the tears you have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — or the water in the four great oceans?"

"As we understand the Dhamma taught to us by the Blessed One, this is the greater: the tears we have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — not the water in the four great oceans."

"Excellent, monks. Excellent. It is excellent that you thus understand the Dhamma taught by me.

"This is the greater: the tears you have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — not the water in the four great oceans.

"Long have you (repeatedly) experienced the death of a mother. The tears you have shed over the death of a mother while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — are greater than the water in the four great oceans.

"Long have you (repeatedly) experienced the death of a father... the death of a brother... the death of a sister... the death of a son... the death of a daughter... loss with regard to relatives... loss with regard to wealth... loss with regard to disease. The tears you have shed over loss with regard to disease while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — are greater than the water in the four great oceans.

"Why is that? From an inconstruable beginning comes transmigration. A beginning point is not evident, though beings hindered by ignorance and fettered by craving are transmigrating & wandering on. Long have you thus experienced stress, experienced pain, experienced loss, swelling the cemeteries — enough to become disenchanted with all fabricated things, enough to become dispassionate, enough to be released."


Yes...thank you Hanzze.
http://www.schmuckzauberei.blogspot.com/
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby Hanzze » Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:10 pm

Kataññu Suttas: Gratitude

"Monks, I will teach you the level of a person of no integrity and the level of a person of integrity. Listen & pay close attention. I will speak."

"As you say, lord," the monks responded.

The Blessed One said, "Now what is the level of a person of no integrity? A person of no integrity is ungrateful & unthankful. This ingratitude, this lack of thankfulness, is advocated by rude people. It is entirely on the level of people of no integrity. A person of integrity is grateful & thankful. This gratitude, this thankfulness, is advocated by civil people. It is entirely on the level of people of integrity."

"I tell you, monks, there are two people who are not easy to repay. Which two? Your mother & father. Even if you were to carry your mother on one shoulder & your father on the other shoulder for 100 years, and were to look after them by anointing, massaging, bathing, & rubbing their limbs, and they were to defecate & urinate right there [on your shoulders], you would not in that way pay or repay your parents. If you were to establish your mother & father in absolute sovereignty over this great earth, abounding in the seven treasures, you would not in that way pay or repay your parents. Why is that? Mother & father do much for their children. They care for them, they nourish them, they introduce them to this world. But anyone who rouses his unbelieving mother & father, settles & establishes them in conviction; rouses his unvirtuous mother & father, settles & establishes them in virtue; rouses his stingy mother & father, settles & establishes them in generosity; rouses his foolish mother & father, settles & establishes them in discernment: To this extent one pays & repays one's mother & father."
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html

BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Ones parents and the first step into Dhamma

Postby HWP » Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:28 am

Hanzze wrote:
Kataññu Suttas: Gratitude

"I tell you, monks, there are two people who are not easy to repay. Which two? Your mother & father. Even if you were to carry your mother on one shoulder & your father on the other shoulder for 100 years, and were to look after them by anointing, massaging, bathing, & rubbing their limbs, and they were to defecate & urinate right there [on your shoulders], you would not in that way pay or repay your parents. If you were to establish your mother & father in absolute sovereignty over this great earth, abounding in the seven treasures, you would not in that way pay or repay your parents. Why is that? Mother & father do much for their children. They care for them, they nourish them, they introduce them to this world. But anyone who rouses his unbelieving mother & father, settles & establishes them in conviction; rouses his unvirtuous mother & father, settles & establishes them in virtue; rouses his stingy mother & father, settles & establishes them in generosity; rouses his foolish mother & father, settles & establishes them in discernment: To this extent one pays & repays one's mother & father."

I fully agree with this. This reminds me of my mother. She had slogged her entire life for the family. She had always placed her needs secondary to that of all family members, and was always the chief mediator in the family. There would never be anyone who would love me more than my mother. I hope that whatever Kamma that gave her a hard life is fully ripen and that she would be left with the good Kamma she cultivated in this life.
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