Cruelty

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rowyourboat
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Cruelty

Post by rowyourboat »

Cruelty, to others (and perhaps even ourselves) is not something which often doesn't get talked about. There are links to sadistic ways of thought- pleasure from inflicting physical/verbal or other 'injury' to others.

I find it concerning that dhamma boards become 'hunting grounds', for seeking a good fight.

What do you think, bearing in mind that very early on in the path non-cruelty (avihimsa) forms a basis for all actions which follow on from there. Aversion and cruelty/violence/aggression/spitefulness seem different things.

I don't wish to blame, but rather understand these thoughts for what they are. There are ways of working with them, once they are identified.

With metta

Matheesha
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha
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retrofuturist
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Re: Cruelty

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings RYB,
rowyourboat wrote:I find it concerning that dhamma boards become 'hunting grounds', for seeking a good fight.
Do you think this is actually so? You have read the minds of others and know their mind states and intentions?
rowyourboat wrote:I don't wish to blame, but rather understand these thoughts for what they are
Perhaps they are speculative projection?
rowyourboat wrote:There are ways of working with them, once they are identified.
Indeed.

MN 18: Madhupindika Sutta
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Ben
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Ben »

Hi Matheesha,
If you think something requires moderator attention, all you need to do is click on a posts 'report' button and one of us will look into it.
kind regards

Ben
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Dan74
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Dan74 »

I don't think it is so much about cruelty but about ego and validation - "I know this and you don't", "I understand this and you don't".

I've been guilty of this myself and I guess there is a few others who fall prey to this thinking too.

I don't think I've seen anything that could even remotely be called "cruelty" here but maybe I've forgotten or overlooked it?
_/|\_
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Aloka
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Aloka »

Dan74 wrote:I don't think it is so much about cruelty but about ego and validation - "I know this and you don't", "I understand this and you don't".
I think that might possibly be the case with the occasional poster. I once had a pm from someone telling me that I obviously had a problem with those who knew more than me ! I was totally bemused, and it certainly isn't the case, because having changed traditions I'm eager to learn from others here.

In general though, I don't think being able to quote and discuss lots of suttas will automatically make us good practitioners - though its wonderful if people can have both.

Apart from that little episode, I haven't noticed anyone being cruel on the forums. Making fun maybe - but that's fine with me because I like seeing some humour occasionally .

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Jhana4
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Jhana4 »

rowyourboat;

I certainly agree that webboards can be an electronic Mara, choch full of compulsive, unhealthy mental states as motivations.
Cruel? No, not that intense in my opinion.
In reading the scriptures, there are two kinds of mistakes:
One mistake is to cling to the literal text and miss the inner principles.
The second mistake is to recognize the principles but not apply them to your own mind, so that you waste time and just make them into causes of entanglement.
Jhana4
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Jhana4 »

Aloka wrote: I think that might possibly be the case with the occasional poster. I once had a pm from someone telling me that I obviously had a problem with those who knew more than me ! I was totally bemused, and it certainly isn't the case, because having changed traditions I'm eager to learn from others here.
A few weeks ago someone PMed me to tell me that they didn't like my views and would be blocking all future posts of mine.
It was the same sort of thing as I've witnessed on non-buddhist web boards, where someone who could have done the same action anonymously, sent a note as a means of catharsis. What was different was that it was extremely polite, even with his intentions being obvious. I found that to be very amusing and ingratiating.

In general though, I don't think being able to quote and discuss lots of suttas will automatically make us good practitioners - though its wonderful if people can have both.
Ditto.

I think that is also true of people who sit. Maybe it takes a lot sitting over a long stretch of time, but I have seen many meditators, myself included behaving worse than they know how to behave.
In reading the scriptures, there are two kinds of mistakes:
One mistake is to cling to the literal text and miss the inner principles.
The second mistake is to recognize the principles but not apply them to your own mind, so that you waste time and just make them into causes of entanglement.
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andre9999
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Re: Cruelty

Post by andre9999 »

I would like to think that virtual strangers on a web board can't do anything to me that I would consider cruel, especially considering that no one here knows me that well. I mean, really, what can they say that would have any emotional effect? That they hate red hair? That I'm a poopy-faced doodyhead?

If someone doesn't like what I say to the point they want to PM me and tell me so, then that leaves me two options:

1. Evaluate my previous speech and make sure I'm being the person that I want to be.
2. Determine that my speech is fine and that the person has their own issues to work out.

#1 might bum me out for a bit. But cruelty? I don't think so.
Jhana4
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Jhana4 »

andre9999 wrote: I mean, really, what can they say that would have any emotional effect?
It happens every day on the internet. Look at all of the people on the web who spend hours ( sometimes equivalent to the amount of a part time job ) putting up hate blogs and complaining about forums they participated in. Nothing physical or financial happened to them, nor anything that would effect their lives beyond their computer. They "only" got their feelings hurt.
In reading the scriptures, there are two kinds of mistakes:
One mistake is to cling to the literal text and miss the inner principles.
The second mistake is to recognize the principles but not apply them to your own mind, so that you waste time and just make them into causes of entanglement.
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andre9999
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Re: Cruelty

Post by andre9999 »

Let me clarify. I meant "what could they say to me?"

And it is, of course, a rhetorical question. They can say nothing of consequence. You would think that a practicing buddhist of any length should be able to have a similar attitude, but I don't know how other peoples' minds work.
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Re: Cruelty

Post by Jhana4 »

andre9999 wrote:Let me clarify. I meant "what could they say to me?"
That your are literally a pencil necked disembodied head? :)

You would think that a practicing buddhist of any length should be able to have a similar attitude, but I don't know how other peoples' minds work.
I've created threads about this topic. The short version is that I think people don't learn to apply their Buddhism, their meditation and their restraint to the internet in addition the other areas of their life. It is like how the best people will rudely give the people the finger on the highway, but would never do anything like that in person........even if the threat of reprisals is not an issue.
In reading the scriptures, there are two kinds of mistakes:
One mistake is to cling to the literal text and miss the inner principles.
The second mistake is to recognize the principles but not apply them to your own mind, so that you waste time and just make them into causes of entanglement.
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retrofuturist
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Re: Cruelty

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,

Seeing as this topic didn't really have much to do with meditation in the first place and has drifted even further since, it will be closed.

I would recommend that if anyone wants to continue the discussion on forum conflict, they may do so in this existing topic.

Why is there so much disagreement?
http://dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=7530" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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