Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
That is while we are doing our day to day normal activities.
Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
- retrofuturist
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Greetings Sarath,
Yes. In relation to body-focused practices, the sutta itself even makes explicit reference to the full range of possible body positions.
Practices focused on the mind are as applicable whether you are sat down, eyes closed, as they are in other positions.
Metta,
Retro.
Yes. In relation to body-focused practices, the sutta itself even makes explicit reference to the full range of possible body positions.
Practices focused on the mind are as applicable whether you are sat down, eyes closed, as they are in other positions.
Metta,
Retro.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Yes, as retro says of course you can because it should be developed within a range of postures.
The question is though can you develop a momentum in the practice of Satipatthana without the support of formal sitting, I think that would be very difficult for most people.
The question is though can you develop a momentum in the practice of Satipatthana without the support of formal sitting, I think that would be very difficult for most people.
Pronouns (no self / not self)
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
- retrofuturist
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Greetings,
Metta,
Retro.
I see the difference in being the number of potential distractions that present themselves, and the risk of getting caught up in the content, rather than not-clinging to it. In other words, I think it's a product of sense-restraint.Goofaholix wrote:The question is though can you develop a momentum in the practice of Satipatthana without the support of formal sitting, I think that would be very difficult for most people.
Metta,
Retro.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Yes, the Satipatthana Sutta alludes to the fact that Satipatthana can be practiced in a multitude of daily activities by listing the four body postures. Certainly, in the instruction I have been given by my teacher one begins by getting established in the sitting posture but after a while he encouraged his students to carry the mental cultivation on regardless of what one is doing whether it be eating, defecating, sleeping, walking, or whatever.SarathW wrote:Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
That is while we are doing our day to day normal activities.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725
Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global Relief • UNHCR
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- Cormac McCarthy, The Road
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725
Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global Relief • UNHCR
e: [email protected]..
- Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
To turn the question around, “Are we practising Satipatthāna if we only do formal sitting?”
I think it was Chanmyay Sayādaw who likened mindfulness of daily activities to the mortar in a wall, Without mindfulness of daily activities, one's practice is very weak, like a wall built without mortar.
By the same reasoning, a wall built only of mortar would also be very weak, and it would also be expensive and time-consuming to build.
We need to practice many things to develop and strengthen our daily meditation practice:
I think it was Chanmyay Sayādaw who likened mindfulness of daily activities to the mortar in a wall, Without mindfulness of daily activities, one's practice is very weak, like a wall built without mortar.
By the same reasoning, a wall built only of mortar would also be very weak, and it would also be expensive and time-consuming to build.
We need to practice many things to develop and strengthen our daily meditation practice:
- Refine and purify our morality
- Give charity and serve others whenever we can
- Listen to, read, and discuss the Buddha's teachings
- Practice formal sitting meditation
- Practice formal walking meditation
- Practice mindfulness of daily activities
- Reflect well over the food that we take
- Extend loving-kindness to all
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
That's certainly been my experience.Goofaholix wrote:The question is though can you develop a momentum in the practice of Satipatthana without the support of formal sitting, I think that would be very difficult for most people.
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Without a solid grounding in a formal practice, you will not get very far with a daily kitchen sink level practice. One of the things a formal practice will give you is a sense of, an understanding of, an experience of, mindfulness that that can then carry over into your daily life. Without that you are doing naught more than guessing and (to use a word popular on this forum) fabricating. Doing a couple of intensive retreats, such as the 10 day Goenka intensives (even you choose not to do the Goenka style at home) can give you a good introduction to the experience of mindfulness and concentration. Also, an ongoing daily formal practice is important in maintaining the momentum of practice.SarathW wrote:Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
That is while we are doing our day to day normal activities.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
The Gradual Training states exactly the reverse of this.tiltbillings wrote:Without a solid grounding in a formal practice, you will not get very far with a daily kitchen sink level practice.SarathW wrote:Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
That is while we are doing our day to day normal activities.
- "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.
"And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.
- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
So is the emphasis on sitting meditation a western thing?daverupa wrote:The Gradual Training states exactly the reverse of this.
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Greetings,
Metta,
Retro.
Yes, I think that's so. In fact, in a recent topic I gave reasons why I think the bhikkhus in the audience for the Satipatthana Sutta were all at least sotapanna.daverupa wrote:The Gradual Training states exactly the reverse of this.
Metta,
Retro.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
The three training of morality, concentration, and wisdom should not be thought of as three steps on a ladder, but as the three legs of a tripod. They each support the other two.
Newly ordained monks were trained in mindfulness from day one, how to wear the robe, how to carry the bowl, how to receive alms and eat paying attention to the almsbowl, etc. It is all mindfulness of daily activities. However, I am sure that they were also instructed in formal sitting and walking meditation too. That didn't happen only after they had become fully accomplished in morality.
Without gaining mental tranquillity by doing ānāpāna etc., one won't remember all of the minute Vinaya rules.
Newly ordained monks were trained in mindfulness from day one, how to wear the robe, how to carry the bowl, how to receive alms and eat paying attention to the almsbowl, etc. It is all mindfulness of daily activities. However, I am sure that they were also instructed in formal sitting and walking meditation too. That didn't happen only after they had become fully accomplished in morality.
Without gaining mental tranquillity by doing ānāpāna etc., one won't remember all of the minute Vinaya rules.
Blog • Pāli Fonts • In This Very Life • Buddhist Chronicles • Software (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)
Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
This is the Budhas advice:
"First establish yourself in the starting point of wholesome states, that is, in purified moral discipline and in right view. Then, when your moral discipline is purified and your view straight, you should practice the four foundations of mindfulness" (SN 47:3)
Liberation is the inevitable fruit of the path and is bound to blossom forth when there is steady and persistent practice. The only requirements for reaching the final goal are two: to start and to continue. If these requirements are met there is no doubt the goal will be attained. This is the Dhamma, the undeviating law.
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- tiltbillings
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Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
Elaborate, please.daverupa wrote:The Gradual Training states exactly the reverse of this.tiltbillings wrote:Without a solid grounding in a formal practice, you will not get very far with a daily kitchen sink level practice.SarathW wrote:Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
That is while we are doing our day to day normal activities.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Can we practice Satipatthana without a formal sitting?
tiltbillings wrote:Elaborate, please.
Most people seem to choose remote lodgings far earlier than this, but we can see that there are preliminary steps: Sila in many ways, of course, but then Guarding the Senses (GS), Mindfulness & Clear Comprehension (M&CC), and Contentment with Little (CwL). This is the kitchen sink.MN 107 wrote:As soon, brahman, as he is possessed of mindfulness and clear consciousness, the Tathagata disciplines him further, saying: 'Come you, monk, choose a remote lodging in a forest, at the root of a tree, on a mountain slope, in a glen, a hill cave, a cemetery, a woodland grove, in the open, or on a heap of straw.
Now, satipatthana (in any posture) is the framework for all of this; seated satipatthana is possible on its own, but it can also be the framework for a concerted effort - anapanasati - that is designed to lead into jhana. One must be well-possessed of the preceding Path aspects for it to be well-advised to retreat into solitude.
So yes: for the most part, modern/Western Buddhist folk are practicing the doorway into jhana long before they have even made a concerted effort at mindfulness each hour, to say nothing of each mouthful of food...
- "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.
"And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.
- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]