Seeking ordination 2: the revival of the aspiration

[brainprogrammed]

Hello Dhamma brothers and sisters, I hope you are very well and happy

Let me introduce myself first: my name is Miguel Rico, I´m 29 years old and I´m from Bogotá /Colombia - south america.
For the last 7 years I´ve been studying and practicing the Buddha Dhamma. With Buddhism from one side I´m also a Yoga student and I work as a Yoga teacher.

I first encountered Buddha Dhamma within the Tibetan tradition and a few years later I became interested in getting ordained. On 2013 I lived in Nalanda (a Gelugpa Tibetan Monastery for westerners in the south of France) and I was going to get ordained there but in the end I declined. Later I lived in Dhammapala Monastery in Switzerland and then I came back to Colombia. Since then I´ve studying pretty much the early discourses (suttas/agamas) and I have a eager interest in investigating and follow the early teachings of the Buddha.

Now, 2 years later after living again a normal life I decided that the best is to get ordained and now having just a little more experience in both traditions I will like to get ordained under the Theravada tradition so I´m searching as far as possible for the best suitable Monastery for me.

The plan is to travel probably on 2016...right i´m on the saving money mode

I´m interested: in a Monastery that can give as far as possible proper training and guidance on the Dhamma, meditation and monastic rules according to the suttas/agamas and not based on the commentaries and late interpretations.

-I´m interested on a Monastery that can be open and respect other traditions, etc.

I´m not interested: on sectarian teachings, exclusive sectarian meditation techniques and hierarchies, nonsense cultural rituals (by that I mean some places where they say you should just follow this teacher, follow only this teaching and only this kind of meditation, discourage other traditions and discourage people from study the suttas, etc). Of course I say it without trying to offense anyone

In any case I know I must have a earthgrounded and open mind....

I´m pretty open if the Monastery is in Sri Lanka, Burma, Thailand, Australia, Usa or another place in the world or galaxy hehe

If there is such a Monastery? I just don´t know hehehe but I have to ask and begin somewhere, right? That´s why I post it here.

Any guidance, information, ideas from the more experienced and unexperienced Sangha will be all well received.

with all due respect, I hope for the best for all of you and I wish you the best!

With so much metta,

Miguel

[pilgrim]

Hi Miguel, I think the monasteries o the Ajhan Chah tradition suits your requirements. http://forestsangha.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But you have stayed in Dhammapala, so is there any reason this is not your immediate choice?

[Kumara]

Looking at your requirements, it seems my monastery suits you. Unfortunately though Malaysian immigration policies (and hidden policies) for monks are.... sigh.... let's not talk about it.

Immigration matters wise, Sri Lanka is most welcoming. You'll have to be okay with spicy food though. I was told some time back that there's a monastery there that emphasize returning to the earlier teachings. Can't remember the name now. Maybe someone else do.

But, really, what's the point of becoming a monk? If the teacher a capable of guiding you to freedom, so what if he doesn't know the suttas? Nonetheless, I too would avoid teachers who are dismissive and makes exclusive claims.

[Bakmoon]

I think that one good candidate that comes to mind would be Bodhinyana monastery in Perth, Australia. They are under the guidance of the very well known teacher Ajahn Brahm. He and his followers put a lot of emphasis on learning the Suttas and the original teachings as opposed to later interpretations.

Ajahn Brahm and some of his disciples (such as Ajahn Brahmali and Ajahn Sujato) have a lot of their talks on youtube, so I would suggest listening to their talks to see if you agree with their teachings.

[Kumara]

I think that one good candidate that comes to mind would be Bodhinyana monastery in Perth, Australia. They are under the guidance of the very well known teacher Ajahn Brahm. He and his followers put a lot of emphasis on learning the Suttas and the original teachings as opposed to later interpretations.

Ajahn Brahm and some of his disciples (such as Ajahn Brahmali and Ajahn Sujato) have a lot of their talks on youtube, so I would suggest listening to their talks to see if you agree with their teachings.

I'm a bit sorry to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

[tiltbillings]

I'm a bit sorry the to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

Oh, damn! Nothing is perfect.

[Pondera]

Kumara wrote:
I'm a bit sorry the to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

Is there something not right with Buddhaghosa's plagiarized explanation of jhana absorption?

[tiltbillings]

Kumara wrote:
I'm a bit sorry the to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

Is there something not right with Buddhaghosa's plagiarized explanation of jhana absorption?

And Buddhaghosa "plagiarized" it from where?

[Kumara]

Kumara wrote:
I'm a bit sorry the to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

Is there something not right with Buddhaghosa's plagiarized explanation of jhana absorption?

Let's not derail the thread any further, ok? Mine was just to contribute to OP's interest.

[tiltbillings]

Kumara wrote:
I'm a bit sorry the to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

Is there something not right with Buddhaghosa's plagiarized explanation of jhana absorption?

Let's not derail the thread any further, ok? Mine was just to contribute to OP's interest.

Or yours could just as easily derailed the thread.

[Pondera]

Sorry.

[Pondera]

Kumara wrote:
I'm a bit sorry the to ask this, but isn't it obvious that Ajahn Brahm teaches Visuddhimagga jhana?

Is there something not right with Buddhaghosa's plagiarized explanation of jhana absorption?

And Buddhaghosa "plagiarized" it from where?

Well, since you asked.
I reckon the vimuttimagga is an earlier work. IMO, it is the vidsudimagga with less rigorous details.

somewhere in the text of the vidsudimagga, it is conveyed that the entire book was written in one sitting. Which is kind of preposterous and ironic given that the "bare bones" of the book are identical to the topics in the earlier vimuttimagga.

[Dhammanando]

somewhere in the text of the vidsudimagga, it is conveyed that the entire book was written in one sitting.

That story is actually from the Cūḷavaṃsa, composed many years later.

[Dhammanando]

If there is such a Monastery?

No, there is no monastery on earth that meets your stipulations.

In saying that, I don't mean merely that there happens not to be one, but that as a point of principle there cannot be one because at least one of your demands is impossible (you're averse to hierarchy, but in any monastery with more than one bhikkhu a hierarchy is what you'll get), while others are mutually contradictory.

I suggest you draw up a shorter and less pernickety shopping list. Or better still, leave your shopping list in Bogotá and come out to tour the monasteries of Asia with an open mind.

[Ahura Mazda]

I´m not interested: on sectarian teachings, exclusive sectarian meditation techniques and hierarchies, nonsense cultural rituals (by that I mean some places where they say you should just follow this teacher, follow only this teaching and only this kind of meditation, discourage other traditions and discourage people from study the suttas, etc). Of course I say it without trying to offense anyone

Bro, all sects of Buddhism recognize each other as valid. But non sectarian Buddhism or non sectarian meditation practices does not exist (it's actually an oxymoron) - precisely because there are many sects, not just one and all of them differ more or less - either because of slightly different interpretation of the same texts, having different texts or even religious syncretism (Tibetan Buddhism).

You also cannot have culture-free Buddhism because Buddhism originated in India, and as such, accepting it means accepting certain parts of Indian culture and mentality.