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Can you become a monk if you have a pension? - Dhamma Wheel

Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Discussion of ordination, the Vinaya and monastic life. How and where to ordain? Bhikkhuni ordination etc.
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puppha
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Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby puppha » Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:35 pm

I probably need to elaborate a bit on this one!
Suppose the following scenario: a man starts working in his 20s, and he gets a pension from his employer. He contributes to his pension, and his employer too. Now for some reason, 10 years later, he wants to leave the lay life and become a monk.
Now, he can sell his house, close his bank accounts, etc. so he can get rid of anything... except his pension. It is an asset than stays "dormant" until retirement age, at which date it kicks in and pays him a regular income.

Is it allowable for him to become a monk in this situation? I would tend to think this is actually a very common situation...

Metta

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Cittasanto
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Cittasanto » Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:53 pm

when there is a yet to be recieved pension?
I don't see why not. it could be provided to the monastery or another arrangement made for it to be dealt with


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Goofaholix » Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:32 pm

It is allowable for a monk to have money, it's just not allowable for him to handle it himself so he needs to appoint a layperson as steward to handle his affairs for him.

So in the case of a pension this could just keep building up until the monk needed a plane ticket for example, then the steward would need to make the withdrawal and buy the ticket.

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puppha
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby puppha » Mon Nov 12, 2012 10:28 am

Thanks Cittasanto & Goofaholix for your comments. I would also tend to think that it shouldn't be a problem. Any Bhikkhu(ni) would be welcome to comment on that point too!

I also just realised that my question also applies to state pension as well... So that makes it even more universal!

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Sambojjhanga
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Sambojjhanga » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:04 pm

Since pretty much every American who has held a job during their lifetime (unless the Republicans get their way) will receive at least some social security pension when they reach retirement age, it seems that no American could ever become a monk if this were the case. Since there are many American monks, it stands to reason that this shouldn't be an issue.

I , too, would be very interested in hearing from an American monk (preferably of social security benefit age) as to how this is handled.

Metta,

:anjali:
The flavor of the dhamma exceeds all other flavors

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Mr Man
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Mr Man » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:26 pm


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Goofaholix
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Goofaholix » Mon Nov 12, 2012 7:03 pm


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mikenz66
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby mikenz66 » Mon Nov 12, 2012 7:37 pm


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Mr Man
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Mr Man » Mon Nov 12, 2012 8:06 pm


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Mr Man
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Mr Man » Mon Nov 12, 2012 8:11 pm


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Sambojjhanga
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Sambojjhanga » Mon Nov 12, 2012 8:47 pm

Remember that social security payments, again, despite the propaganda to the contrary by the Republican Party, is the recipients own money! People pay into the plan from the day they start working until they day they stop.

All in all, I'm not interested in theory or what should or should not be done. I'd really like to hear from a monk who is actually in this position. Surely there are American monks of social security age out there, or at least that are known by people on this forum?

What is the actual practice? I, for one, don't think that a monk SHOULD receive any money directly when they are in robes. But OTOH, I don't think that a person's money which they have contributed to for their working life should simply go to the state.

As others have stated, SOMEONE is paying for the monk's life. Unless he's in the woods either collecting berries, someone is paying.

Just curious what really happens in practice.

Metta,

:anjali:
The flavor of the dhamma exceeds all other flavors

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Goofaholix
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Goofaholix » Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:22 pm


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Mr Man
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Mr Man » Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:57 pm


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Cittasanto
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Re: Can you become a monk if you have a pension?

Postby Cittasanto » Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:26 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.


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