Samadhi (best English translation?)

[acinteyyo]

samadhi (composure/collectednes)

+1

'Sammlung' in German also means collection, composure or mental collectedness.

This translation avoids the two extremes of 'concentration' and 'tranquility'.

I also like "composure". Isn't it mentioned somewhere that a mind lacking samādhi is "scattered"?

[daverupa]

MN 138 suggests that a mind externally scattered is a function of consciousness following the drift of the aggregates, of being tied & chained to the attraction of those themes.

A mind internally positioned is similarly tied to the attraction of themes, in this case jhana factors.

So a composed mind is one that does not follow themes, does not become tied to them or roll about in their signs like a dog in a smelly patch. If samadhi is attained, there is no more scattered mind... but, there might be an internally-fixed one...

[Kumara]

MN 138 suggests that a mind externally scattered is a function of consciousness following the drift of the aggregates, of being tied & chained to the attraction of those themes.

A mind internally positioned is similarly tied to the attraction of themes, in this case jhana factors.

So a composed mind is one that does not follow themes, does not become tied to them or roll about in their signs like a dog in a smelly patch. If samadhi is attained, there is no more scattered mind... but, there might be an internally-fixed one...

Not in my experience of samadhi. Mine's like what Ajahn Chah described: "If your mind is peaceful it will be just like still, flowing water". It's not fixed, but you can say it's firmly tied to awareness.

I'm not saying there's no "internally-fixed" type of samadhi. But I see it as not what the Suttas mean by the word.

[acinteyyo]

I had something along the lines of "hold together" or "put together" in mind in opposition to "scattered"

[daverupa]

The only time I could find the word "scattered" was in a simple reference to mindfulness of state of mind: if it's scattered one knows it, if it's not scattered one knows it.

[acinteyyo]

The only time I could find the word "scattered" was in a simple reference to mindfulness of state of mind: if it's scattered one knows it, if it's not scattered one knows it.

Yes.
Maybe I'm not expressing myself very clearly here. What I was trying to say was that "composure" implies for me "composed" with the meaning of "to put or dispose in proper form or order", "to organize parts", "to settle". This is how I understand samādhi and I thought that "composure" fits well, also compared to the opposite, a lack of samādhi, which is a "scattered", "agitated" mind.

[Kumara]

Evidently further discussion will have to wait until the publication of the book.

I'm pretty much done with the book. Now seeking feedback on accuracy. I invite people deep in the suttas and meditation to ask me for the draft: kumara.bhikkhu@g[DELETE]mail.com

Still no takers from here. I suppose I'm asking too much! Let me rephrase:
I invite people deep in the suttas OR and meditation to PM me with your email address for the draft.

[Kumara]

I had something along the lines of "hold together" or "put together" in mind in opposition to "scattered"

"put together" is literally "samadahati", the active verb form of "samadhi"

[markandeya]

Samadhi is a Pali/Sanskrit technical term for supra mental state. Usually it’s best use In etymology is sa mA and dhi there a number of ways in which this supramental state is used in varies ways sages teach. Sa is perhaps the most difficult to translate into English, especially when Nama and rupa is translated as mental conditions and physical conditions only, we can use Nama and rupa to describe a form or a compounded mental idea as in a emotion or any mental of physical phenomenon, but as these are gradually transcended and citta becomes more aware of more higher states that arises and follows them due to citta natural tendency to follow , Nama and Rupa become or transform on subtle state of being into supramental cosmic name and forms, such as the disciples or expansion of the Buddha, mogallana and sariputra for example who represent cosmic conscious energies of moon and sun forces respectively which then work on the citta bringing it closer to samyak sambodhi full enlightenment

Na represents inner sound of the cosmos in its highest potential , some may call this the sound of silence ma again is the cosmic creation of infinite variety of creation ru means light and pa is to shine, we may sometimes dissect them in linguistics but they are All spontaneously arising simultaneously in the supramental sphere one can’t really seperate them same as with jhana and samadhi , it’s all happening on one state of being, this is known in vipassana or inner seeing, inner being suspended from outgoing distraction of senses and sense objects. They are all happening at different strengths at the same time. Satipathana makes this fully cognitive in the experience

Sa represents these inner cosmic supramental states which unites with Ma the creative potency of cosmic creations such as bodhisattvas

SamA also can represent and includes a state of mind which has transcended the mundane where citta then is aware of a reality above dual states of happiness and distress and other opposites associated with outer attachment to sense and sense objects which are always fleeting unreliable and subject to conditioned arising and is realm of uncertainty, samA is not uncertain it’s a by product or naturally occurring is states of jhana or mental absorption , the deeper the jnana the deeper the state of samadhi the more profound is Nama and rupa

dhi, dh is being held in the light or brightness of the experience dh is when that supra state is being held unmoving and i is again another reference to light stemming of Agni, all the languages of description are happening simultaneously far beyond ordinary intellect and logic which will never grasp the great vision seen in the experiential stages, when these states are part of ones nature one can then see the whole unifying language of states of higher consciousness or awareness which are whole states, etymology is describing states of the citta expanding out of its limited association with mundane attachments to the world that end only in dukkha

[Kumara]

Samadhi is a Pali/Sanskrit technical term for supra mental state. Usually it’s best use In etymology is sa mA and dhi there a number of ways in which this supramental state is used in varies ways sages teach. Sa is perhaps the most difficult to translate into English....

dhi, dh is being held in the light or brightness of the experience dh is when that supra state is being held unmoving and i is again another reference to light stemming of Agni, all the languages of description are happening simultaneously far beyond ordinary intellect and logic which will never grasp the great vision seen in the experiential stages, when these states are part of ones nature one can then see the whole unifying language of states of higher consciousness or awareness which are whole states, etymology is describing states of the citta expanding out of its limited association with mundane attachments to the world that end only in dukkha

You're talking nonsense.

[Pondera]

By and by:

I don’t particularly like “immersion”. This word adds content to the experience. Samādhi is marked by a lack of adherence to regular sensory perception. As such it is also marked by a lack of content. “One pointed concentration” refers to what the mind does in the absence of sense attachment.

[markandeya]

Hehehe hohoho and a bottle of rum.

Maybe to you it doesn't make sense, , but in the reality which is samadhi its crystal clear , samadhi unites everything in one state of wholeness, its simple but profound, and these are ancient teachings, timeless~akaliko ehipassiko~encouraging investigation, i know it doesnt fit into the normal mode but when was that ever the standard.

teachings vada are understood by adhikara not by empirical intellect based on glimpses or intellectual stimulation, which only masks the limitation to arise again, so why build a system to make them into an intellectual logic and empirical teaching.

Ask yourself a question kumara, have you had profound deep experience where you have seen reality as clear as you see the sunrising, where all doubts have ceased and truth is arrived at, where one never needs to question again and then its just growth and expansion. Yes or no, its a introspective question.

Have you seen into the subtle quantum field with your bare attention and seen the secrets of interdependence , no need to answer me, and no need for me to answer these, nor anyone else, answer your self, because at the end of the day its about personal honesty, only a fool would lie to himself.

Another word for samadhi is that which unifies all states into one wholesome reality, have you experienced teh cosmic forms of wisdom , sun and moon cycles shaktis which work on the mind and other cosmic forces, buddha......

Maybe some people experience samadhi , then on the next session they have an vipassana experience, or they practice only vipassana, or they practice only brahma vihara, or they are only practising jhana's, only practising one way systems, where have i heard that before, oh yeah the Sunday club, but what samadhi does is unify all these states into one whole reality.

Ajhan Chah for example would not make any differentiation between samatha and vipassana they are limbs on the same body, he didnt even make any real differentiation between annica, annata and dukkha, or samadhi panna sila they are co dependant, they dont exists separately, why cant this co dependency happen at higher levels, well they do, but they remain undiscovered, or maybe people are waiting to read the best post, the best translations, the smartest etymology, the most precise grammar , but grammar was never part of ancient dharma.

Nama Rupa Nama Rupa Buddha is Rupa of awkening reality in states of samadhi

You can chop a tree down and analyse the chemical component and give smart scientific names, but you will have destroyed the tree, buddha observes the whole tree, roots beneath branches above as one whole, but where do roots end, in a dictionary ? confined to meanings in words.....

hehehe hoho ho and a bottle of rum would you like some mana....

In the supramental states rishis do not even speak in sanskrit or pali or classical Chinese, they remain on the out skirts of brahmanda vibrating codes through mediums to reveal the true nature of form and formless realities, using both form and formless as one whole reality known in samadhi states. Pali/Sanskrit are languages that reflect experience in phonetics in higher domains to use in sadhanas and practices of recitation to produce higher states of mind, citta bhavana, citta bhavana citta bhavana, not for empirical dictionary intellectual translations, as if that is the way these experiences become real, when one hears the languages of the rishis~seers and experiences the citta being awakened by Buddha one cant turn back and get into mundane linguistics, so i thank you for the compliment.

[auto]

Samadhi is a Pali/Sanskrit technical term for supra mental state. Usually it’s best use In etymology is sa mA and dhi there a number of ways in which this supramental state is used in varies ways sages teach. Sa is perhaps the most difficult to translate into English, especially when Nama and rupa is translated as mental conditions and physical conditions only, we can use Nama and rupa to describe a form or a compounded mental idea as in a emotion or any mental of physical phenomenon, but as these are gradually transcended and citta becomes more aware of more higher states that arises and follows them due to citta natural tendency to follow , Nama and Rupa become or transform on subtle state of being into supramental cosmic name and forms, such as the disciples or expansion of the Buddha, mogallana and sariputra for example who represent cosmic conscious energies of moon and sun forces respectively which then work on the citta bringing it closer to samyak sambodhi full enlightenment

Na represents inner sound of the cosmos in its highest potential , some may call this the sound of silence ma again is the cosmic creation of infinite variety of creation ru means light and pa is to shine, we may sometimes dissect them in linguistics but they are All spontaneously arising simultaneously in the supramental sphere one can’t really seperate them same as with jhana and samadhi , it’s all happening on one state of being, this is known in vipassana or inner seeing, inner being suspended from outgoing distraction of senses and sense objects. They are all happening at different strengths at the same time. Satipathana makes this fully cognitive in the experience

Sa represents these inner cosmic supramental states which unites with Ma the creative potency of cosmic creations such as bodhisattvas

SamA also can represent and includes a state of mind which has transcended the mundane where citta then is aware of a reality above dual states of happiness and distress and other opposites associated with outer attachment to sense and sense objects which are always fleeting unreliable and subject to conditioned arising and is realm of uncertainty, samA is not uncertain it’s a by product or naturally occurring is states of jhana or mental absorption , the deeper the jnana the deeper the state of samadhi the more profound is Nama and rupa

dhi, dh is being held in the light or brightness of the experience dh is when that supra state is being held unmoving and i is again another reference to light stemming of Agni, all the languages of description are happening simultaneously far beyond ordinary intellect and logic which will never grasp the great vision seen in the experiential stages, when these states are part of ones nature one can then see the whole unifying language of states of higher consciousness or awareness which are whole states, etymology is describing states of the citta expanding out of its limited association with mundane attachments to the world that end only in dukkha

i think i can accept the sun and moon thing. Which i have done already in some form of 'sun and moon channel and central channel' simplicity. I now see better how it is presented in different concentration descriptions.

Moon channel example: sensual organ sensation is reflected into happiness. Reflected - You know it after the fact in the minds eye. Thus you stop having wrong manasikara towards happiness. Besides that reflection, you going to also know (acquainted) the sensation in general.

[BVira]

Since the "word" samadhi itself contains a compound of meanings (from sam with, together + a towards + the verbal root dha to place, bring) I don't see how parity could be achieved for this "word" in a single English meaning (or 'word').

So maybe "to-direct-collectedly-towards", the mental faculties being what is collectedly directed, and jhana being what it is towards (in the case of sammasamadhi)

Or perhaps "composed-guidance-into"

[Kumara]

Since the "word" samadhi itself contains a compound of meanings (from sam with, together + a towards + the verbal root dha to place, bring) I don't see how parity could be achieved for this "word" in a single English meaning (or 'word').

So maybe "to-direct-collectedly-towards", the mental faculties being what is collectedly directed, and jhana being what it is towards (in the case of sammasamadhi)

Or perhaps "composed-guidance-into"

Have you seen this?