the great vegetarian debate

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
kannada
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by kannada »

Tex wrote:DISCLAIMER: Voting intended for Theravadins only please; discussion is of course welcomed from all traditions.
With respect to Tex's wishes I did not vote, however I have been a vegetarian for the last 36 years...

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adamposey
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by adamposey »

I've chosen to go with a middle way on this matter. I do not want to take a hardline "yes" or "no" answer. During my admittedly limited research into Buddhism and Theravada specifically this topic has come up and I've found this to be the best answer without going to an extreme: "Yes, but..."

What I mean by that is that the bhikkus, who are supposed to be an example for us, are not necessarily strict vegetarians. They are supposed to accept the generosity of others, and should that include meat, then so be it. What that says to me is that it is best to minimize one's footprint of death in the world to the greatest extent possible and becoming a vegetarian is a means to that end. But that said there are cultural traditions in my country, etc., that meat plays a very important part in. Would I be a good buddhist to refuse the generosity of my family when they spend hours preparing a meat based food for holidays? Should I burden them with my special diet? In my case I've decided the answer is "no," and so I'll be a vegetarian when it comes to my personal decisions of what to buy for myself, but when it comes to others offering me food—all bets are off.

That said.. I'm Theravada but I don't know how I should answer this poll.
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Jechbi
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Jechbi »

Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
André
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by André »

I'm not a vegetarian, but I'm considering it. If I do become one, then I would still eat meat if I were offered it. That much am I certain of.
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Potato
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Potato »

I voted before I saw the disclaimer. :(

I have been vegetarian for five years.
BudSas
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by BudSas »

I don't vote because to me, it's a non-issue! :smile:

I consider myself as a sensible eater, I eat sensibly to keep my body healthy enough to practice the Dhamma, and the diet varies according to my own daily activities. Normally, I east mostly vegetables, fruits, and a bit of meat (read & white meats, seafood). However, for periods of intensive meditation retreat without heavy physical workloads, I eat less, and mostly on a vegetarian diet.

My main priority when eating is related to how to eat mindfully, one bit at a time, chewing slowly and carefully, noting the sensation at the tongue, the reaction of the mind to different taste, etc. To me, that's more important than to argue on the issue whether one should be a vegetarian or not.

BDS
Clueless Git
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Clueless Git »

'Lo all :)

I'm not Theravedan, nor strictly any other tradition in particular, so I haven't voted.

I am vegan and was already vegan before becoming interested in buddhism.

I suffer a peculiar mental disorder that prevents me from seeing meat without simultaneoulsy seeing the cycle of suffering it causes and gives me a strong desire for all sentient beings to be free of it.

My initial attraction to buddhism, was by my interpretation, that being able to see dependant arisings of suffering and wishing all sentient beings to be free of them is not a peculiar mental disorder.
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Dugu
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Dugu »

I am trying to become Vegetarian. I have decided to cut down my meat consumption so that my body and habit can slowly adapt to a full vegetarian way of life. And if I do become a vegetarian, I won't try and impose my preference on anyone who offer me food. I would just eat what they give, except meat that was specifically killed for me.
PeterB
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by PeterB »

Clueless Git wrote:'Lo all :)

I'm not Theravedan, nor strictly any other tradition in particular, so I haven't voted.

I am vegan and was already vegan before becoming interested in buddhism.

I suffer a peculiar mental disorder that prevents me from seeing meat without simultaneoulsy seeing the cycle of suffering it causes and gives me a strong desire for all sentient beings to be free of it.

My initial attraction to buddhism, was by my interpretation, that being able to see dependant arisings of suffering and wishing all sentient beings to be free of them is not a peculiar mental disorder.
That wish is not evidence of a mental disorder. However that wish like all phenomena arises dependantly. Suffering is prior to the killing of animals for meat and that would be the case even if everyone on the planet ate a vegetarian or vegan diet. The first link in the chain of suffering is Ignorance, ignorance not simply of the effects of dukkha , but existentially. It arises with our arising, with our consciousness of our selves and our identity , whether that identity is that of burger eater or vegan. To wish the good of all creatures is commendable, to wish them free from suffering is evidence of compassion. There is something though which in terms of Buddhism is primary, and that is available to all what ever diet they choose. That is the Jhanas and/or Insight.
kannada
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by kannada »

The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want
He makes me down to lie
Through pastures green He leadeth me the silent waters by.
With bright knives He releaseth my soul.
He maketh me to hang on hooks in high places.
He converteth me to lamb cutlets,
For lo, He hath great power, and great hunger.
When cometh the day we lowly ones,
Through quiet reflection, and great dedication
Master the art of karate,
Lo, we shall rise up,
And then we'll make the bugger's eyes water.

Bleating and babbling I fell on his neck with a scream.
Wave upon wave of demented avengers
March cheerfully out of obscurity into the dream.


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A Medic
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by A Medic »

Potato wrote:I voted before I saw the disclaimer. :(

I have been vegetarian for five years.

Same here I voted before I read the disclaimer. :oops: I voted the thinking about it. I've been going back and forth for years between being a vegetarian and not being one. I do personally think it its the best thing to do.
Northernbuck
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Northernbuck »

I am considering becoming a full vegetarian. Currently I avoid beef, but for health reasons. I do eat chicken and fish right now. I have to do some more research and then decide. Even though it has been a couple of months, I do consider myself a Theravada Buddhist.
But if this neutral feeling that has arisen is conditioned by the body which is impermanent, compounded and dependently arisen, how could such a neutral feeling be permanent? - SN 36.7
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Annapurna
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Annapurna »

I ignored only Theravadins may vote. What am I? :tongue:

I eat very little meat. I've had times where I went without for a year.

I often notice I'm healthier when I don't eat meat.

The suffering of animals has made me cry oftentimes.

One of the worst experiences was to look into the eyes of a cow that was chained too shortly , so she couldn't lie down her head, and was lying in her shit on naked cement.

I asked the farmer: Shouldn't there be more straw underneath her? And isn't the chain too short?" and he apologized, saying, usually, yes, or that she is able to lie down.

So, what can I do. Call the cops? I considered it.

I haven't bought veal since then and that should be over 10 years now. .

In any case, I can still see how she looked into my eyes,and held my gaze, for a long time. THAT look I will never forget.

Also the sadness she felt. I did have a feeling she was asking me to do something. I sadly caressed her face.

Perhaps I failed. :weep:
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DNS
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by DNS »

Annabel wrote: In any case, I can still see how she looked into my eyes,and held my gaze, for a long time. THAT look I will never forget.
Also the sadness she felt. I did have a feeling she was asking me to do something. I sadly caressed her face.
Perhaps I failed. :weep:
I had a similar experience in Ethiopia one time. We stopped by the side of the road to purchase some coffee beans and there close-by was a man holding a goat with a small rope around its neck. He was trying to sell the goat. In Ethiopia, to eat meat, you must buy the whole animal, take him home and kill him/her. For this reason, many foreign diplomats become vegetarian, at least while they are in Ethiopia. :tongue:

While the people with me purchased the coffee beans, I petted the goat. The goat immediately gravitated toward me and wanted more petting and attention. As we went back to our car, the goat struggled to come to me. The man with the goat started whipping the goat and pulling at him to stay with him. But the goat just kept coming toward me with all his might. I thought about purchasing the goat, but knew that eventually he would be found and still made into dinner one day, so just waved good-bye.
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Annapurna
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Re: Poll: Are you vegetarian/vegan?

Post by Annapurna »

Oh... :(

I can imagine how you felt. I can also imagine how the goat felt.

Oh dear...

I once took an ill kitten in, and cared for her until it was well.

Hr gratitude was sobeautiful.

Each morning she would crawl next to my ill mother, and constantly gaze into her eyes, and seemed to smile, really. She gave her this confident, cheerful look, paw on lap, and purred away, and the old lady was delighted.

I would find the two next to each other, communicating with each other, each in her own way....

Amazing cat she was.

Her name was Jeannie, after "I dream of Jeannie".

:heart:
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