Untrue.
That is nihilism, not Buddhism.
Buddhists are losers?
- TheNoBSBuddhist
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
You will not be punished FOR your 'emotions'; you will be punished BY your 'emotions'.
Pay attention, simplify, and (Meditation instruction in a nutshell) "Mind - the Gap."
‘Absit invidia verbo’ - may ill-will be absent from the word. And mindful of that, if I don't respond, this may be why....
Re: Buddhists are losers?
It is the way it is.TheNoBSBuddhist wrote:Untrue.
That is nihilism, not Buddhism.
I can not say to my body to not aging, get ill or dead, i can not choose my mental formation i can just contamplate those which already arise.
Soo i have no full control of it. If i have not full control of it - it's not belong to me. It's not me, mine, my self.
Nihilism (from Pali Canon point of view) is the view that there is no given, no offered, no fruit of good or bad action, no this life no the next life etc.
- TheNoBSBuddhist
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
you have partial control. So it is partially yours.walkart wrote:Very good reasoning.Denisa wrote:In order to lose something, first, one has to posses it (either material or immaterial). Those who goes after gain, status, censure, and pleasure will someday face loss, disgrace, praise, and pain. Therefore one who posses less lose less, perhaps nothing.
Actually nothing is in our possesion. Our body, feeling, perceptions, mental formation, consciousness - all this is out of our full control, so we dont "have" it, it's not our proprety.
To exempt yourself from full control is to say that you are not responsible for everything you think/say/do.
I disagree with your logic.
There is Not-Self.
But there is also Self.
so to a great extent, the body most certainly is yours.
if it is not fully yours, who else controls what happens to it?
You will not be punished FOR your 'emotions'; you will be punished BY your 'emotions'.
Pay attention, simplify, and (Meditation instruction in a nutshell) "Mind - the Gap."
‘Absit invidia verbo’ - may ill-will be absent from the word. And mindful of that, if I don't respond, this may be why....
Re: Buddhists are losers?
Buddha said that 5 khandhas are not me, mine, my self.TheNoBSBuddhist wrote:
you have partial control. So it is partially yours.
To exempt yourself from full control is to say that you are not responsible for everything you think/say/do.
I disagree with your logic.
There is Not-Self.
But there is also Self.
so to a great extent, the body most certainly is yours.
if it is not fully yours, who else controls what happens to it?
I dont belief in self, in somethink that exist without conditions. I dont find it in any of 5 khandhas.
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
In my opinion, Buddhists are not losers by any definition. A loser in unambitious, lazy, not interested in pursuing wealth, career, employment or anything else. Buddhists are not unambitious, since they strive for enlightenment. See my post on the first page of this thread.
http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.ph ... 32#p273964
They are also not losers in worldly terms either. Many Buddhists are successful in film, sports, politics, business, careers, etc. Of course the majority are middle class or lower. This is true of any demographic group, including Christians, Muslims, Hindus, etc. The rich are called the One Percent for a reason: they are only 1% of the population. Only 1% of Christians are very wealthy. Only 1% of Muslims are very wealthy; etc. etc.
According to this site: http://www.worldwealthcalculator.org/ you only need to make $33,500 per year to be in the top 5%. You need to make $69,000 per year to be in the top 1%. We probably have many DWers who are in the top 1% or top 5%.
You can be poor and still be a winner. As long as you have some wholesome goals and work diligently toward that, you are a winner. A monk can be a winner. A nun can be a winner. A lay person can be a winner. Even the term sotapanna is often described as "stream-winner".
http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.ph ... 32#p273964
They are also not losers in worldly terms either. Many Buddhists are successful in film, sports, politics, business, careers, etc. Of course the majority are middle class or lower. This is true of any demographic group, including Christians, Muslims, Hindus, etc. The rich are called the One Percent for a reason: they are only 1% of the population. Only 1% of Christians are very wealthy. Only 1% of Muslims are very wealthy; etc. etc.
According to this site: http://www.worldwealthcalculator.org/ you only need to make $33,500 per year to be in the top 5%. You need to make $69,000 per year to be in the top 1%. We probably have many DWers who are in the top 1% or top 5%.
You can be poor and still be a winner. As long as you have some wholesome goals and work diligently toward that, you are a winner. A monk can be a winner. A nun can be a winner. A lay person can be a winner. Even the term sotapanna is often described as "stream-winner".
- TheNoBSBuddhist
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
You practice as you see fit.walkart wrote:Buddha said that 5 khandhas are not me, mine, my self.TheNoBSBuddhist wrote:
you have partial control. So it is partially yours.
To exempt yourself from full control is to say that you are not responsible for everything you think/say/do.
I disagree with your logic.
There is Not-Self.
But there is also Self.
so to a great extent, the body most certainly is yours.
if it is not fully yours, who else controls what happens to it?
I dont belief in self, in somethink that exist without conditions. I dont find it in any of 5 khandhas.
You will not be punished FOR your 'emotions'; you will be punished BY your 'emotions'.
Pay attention, simplify, and (Meditation instruction in a nutshell) "Mind - the Gap."
‘Absit invidia verbo’ - may ill-will be absent from the word. And mindful of that, if I don't respond, this may be why....
Re: Buddhists are losers?
It's funny because many times the buddha was deemed a nihilist and it's true...TheNoBSBuddhist wrote:Untrue.
That is nihilism, not Buddhism.
"Ko imaṃ pathaviṃ vicessati, yamalokañca imaṃ sadevakaṃ.
ko dhammapadaṃ sudesitaṃ, kusalo pupphamiva pacessati"
ko dhammapadaṃ sudesitaṃ, kusalo pupphamiva pacessati"
Re: Buddhists are losers?
ihrjordan wrote:It's funny because many times the buddha was deemed a nihilist and it's true...
Don't have the reference, but I remember reading Buddha saying something like: "There's nothing whatsoever worth clinging and with a core."nihilism
noun
■(Philosophy)extreme scepticism maintaining that nothing in the world has a real existence
Re: Buddhists are losers?
Buddha taught about dependent origination.Denisa wrote:ihrjordan wrote:It's funny because many times the buddha was deemed a nihilist and it's true...Don't have the reference, but I remember reading Buddha saying something like: "There's nothing whatsoever worth clinging and with a core."nihilism
noun
■(Philosophy)extreme scepticism maintaining that nothing in the world has a real existence
He reject the idea the existence and non existence which is a belief due to ignorance.
Dependent Origination is not the middle of existence and non existence either.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
Hi all,walkart wrote: Buddha said that 5 khandhas are not me, mine, my self.
This is a bit off topic (or maybe not really)... but here's a thought: whose khandhas was he speaking of that were not him, his, or his self?
When we try to perceive someone through the khandhas, it turns out that it's never accurate. When we try to cling to them (such as trying to call a couple of disrobed monks as "losers"), I think it usually creates trouble.
- tiltbillings
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
Agreed. This whole "loser" business is nonsense.beeblebrox wrote:Hi all,walkart wrote: Buddha said that 5 khandhas are not me, mine, my self.
This is a bit off topic (or maybe not really)... but here's a thought: whose khandhas was he speaking of that were not him, his, or his self?
When we try to perceive someone through the khandhas, it turns out that it's never accurate. When we try to cling to them (such as trying to call a couple of disrobed monks as "losers"), I think it usually creates trouble.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Buddhists are losers?
We are losers of unwholesome kamma ans sufferings.
- tiltbillings
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Re: Buddhists are losers?
Only if we do the practice, and that certainly has not a thing to do with worldly considerations.walkart wrote:We are losers of unwholesome kamma ans sufferings.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Buddhists are losers?
it's truetiltbillings wrote:Only if we do the practice, and that certainly has not a thing to do with worldly considerations.walkart wrote:We are losers of unwholesome kamma ans sufferings.
Re: Buddhists are losers?
There are ultimate truths and then there are conventional truths.beeblebrox wrote:...
When Buddha said one who disrobed due to a woman is similar to a warrior who ran away after losing the battle, one can say Buddha was talking nonsense since there is no person and it is just khandhas. But Buddha was talking about a conventional truth. When robertk started the thread, he was talking about a conventional truth.
If someone always live in ultimate truth then he/she better stay in that stage without peeking to our mundane conventional world. Because for him what's the point trying to perceive us through the khandhas and clinging to what we say!