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The causes for wisdom - Dhamma Wheel

The causes for wisdom

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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robertk
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The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:02 pm


Coyote
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby Coyote » Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:15 pm

I have been following these threads and would love to know more. Please share your classical understanding from the Tipitaka and commentaries.

Thanks
:anjali:
"If beings knew, as I know, the results of giving & sharing, they would not eat without having given, nor would the stain of miserliness overcome their minds. Even if it were their last bite, their last mouthful, they would not eat without having shared."
Iti 26

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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:01 pm

Anguttara Nikaya
Mahavaggo THE GREAT CHAPTER Blessings

RETHREN, four blessings should be expected from listening to with
the
ear, constant recitation with the voice, careful consideration with
the mind and penetration of the Norm (Dhamma) through insight (1).
What four ?
Herein, brethren, a brother masters the Norm consisting of the
Suttas..... Vedalla (2). He thus listens to, constantly recites,
carefully ponders over and penetrates the Norm. When he dies
bewildered (3) in mind and is reborn in a certain assembly of devas,
there the blissful ones recite to him the stanzas of the Norm.
Brethren, the arising of mindfulness is slow, but such a being
quickly achieves distinction therein.(4) Brethren, this is the first
blessing that should be expected from listening to, constant
recitation, careful consideration and penetration of the Norm
through
insight.

Again, brethren, a brother masters the Norm consisting of the
Suttas,
etc. He thus listens to; [as above] and is reborn in an assembly of
devas. There the blissful ones do not recite to him the stanzas of
the Norm ; but a brother possessed of psychic powers, who has
mastered his mind, proclaims the Norm to the assembly of devas. Then
this thought occurs to him (the former) This is indeed that Norm and
Discipline, according to which I lived the holy life in my previous
existence.' Brethren, slow is the arising of mindfulness. Yet that
being quickly achieves distinction therein.

Brethren, just as a person skilled in the sounds of drums, having
entered a road, hears the sound of a drum, and has no doubt or
uncertainty as to whether it is the sound of a drum or not. Then he
concludes that it is surely the sound of a drum. Just so, brethren,
a
brother masters the Norm consisting of the Suttas, etc. Then he
listens to [as above]. Then indeed that being quickly achieves
distinction therein. Brethren, this is the second blessing that
should be expected from listening to, constant recitation, careful
consideration and penetration of the Norm through insight....

1 Diññiyà,. Comy. says 'himself penetrates it by his wisdom both as
regards sense and cause.'

3 Comy. says 'he is still a puthujjana'' One dying without reaching
the Paths is said to die with mindfulness not established.

4 Comy`. He becomes nibbàna-gàmin (bound for the goal).'

http://www.abhidhamma.org/anguttara_nikaya...(2)%2020htm.htm
best wishes
robert

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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:03 pm

Thanks. I was trying to find the sutta where I think sariputta explains the two causes for wisdom to arise:the voice of another(the Buddha) and wise attention.
Does anyone know it?

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daverupa
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby daverupa » Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:14 pm


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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:22 pm

Nice thanks!
I was actually thinking of this one -which repeats the same words-and which your link gives a link to.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

So anyway the crucial conditions for panna , right view, are hearing true Dhamma from the Buddha or his disciple and wise attention to said Dhamma.

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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby Coyote » Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:37 pm

"If beings knew, as I know, the results of giving & sharing, they would not eat without having given, nor would the stain of miserliness overcome their minds. Even if it were their last bite, their last mouthful, they would not eat without having shared."
Iti 26

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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:30 am

HI coyote,
not sure I understand your question about common parlance?

One important issue I want to bring out is that the idea expressed in the opening post that it is by 'paying attention to our experiences' that wisdom develops, seems not really supported by sutta.

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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:09 am


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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:33 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:40 am


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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:50 am

I wonder why you expect that I know every possible thing that has been or is taught. Is it an important issue.?

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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:54 am


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Spiny Norman
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby Spiny Norman » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:05 am

"My religion is very simple - my religion is ice-cream."
Dairy Lama

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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Wed Jan 23, 2013 12:38 pm

In that sutta it is satisampajanna that needs to be understood and developed. While it is absolutely correct that the sati component knows a reality at the moment if satipatthana it must be in combibation with wisdom ( the pajanapart) to qualify as satipatthana.
And the wisdom in this case progressively understands the anattaness of every moment.
It can be seen as a virtuous circle where correct wise reflection on true Dhamma conditions correct moments of insight leading to deeper intellectual understand ing and rhen more moments of deeper direct experience.

c is true that sati

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tiltbillings
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:59 pm


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Spiny Norman
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby Spiny Norman » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:04 pm

"My religion is very simple - my religion is ice-cream."
Dairy Lama

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Sam Vara
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby Sam Vara » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:54 pm


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robertk
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby robertk » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:54 pm


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beeblebrox
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Re: The causes for wisdom

Postby beeblebrox » Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:40 pm



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