Bhante Vimalaramsi

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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mirco
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by mirco »

tiltbillings wrote:How, or if, you respond to criticisms of Vimalaramsi is your choice. I can see that these criticisms are difficult for you,
Yeah, that is so true. Don't like it, but it's still like that. I tend to glorification.
tiltbillings wrote:and for whatever discomfort I may causing you with this, I am sorry.
That has reached me.

Kind Regards,
Mirco
Last edited by mirco on Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Cittasanto
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by Cittasanto »

mirco wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:
Vimalaramsi wrote:Even today if you go to teachers of one-pointed concentration and ask them: “How does craving arise?” Or you ask them: “What is craving?” They can’t tell you.
Where has Ven. Vimalaramsi answered these questions? I had and could not find it precisely.
Here are two from the articles section: If one listens to the talks or reads the transcipts, one will stumble over his explanations of what craving is and how it works over and over again.

Warm Regards,
Mirco
I see nothing in this that is unique.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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mirco
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by mirco »

Cittasanto wrote:
mirco wrote:
I see nothing in this that is unique.
Good for you :-)
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Dan74
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by Dan74 »

Yes, most, if not all, teachers are imperfect. Even the Buddha made mistakes.

It is great to feel gratitude to the teacher who has brought the Dhamma into ones life and hard to see his faults sometimes. But if the teacher's intentions are basically good and there is some Right View, she/he can be a wonderful blessing inspite of the imperfections, I feel.

I am sorry if this is :offtopic: here, I don't know the teacher under discussion and I agree that "mine is the only way" rings alarm bells, but I hesitate to criticize.

As an aside anecdote, a fellow Buddhist Religious Ed teacher at the school I do this, is a student of a student of Geshe Micheal Roach, a Tibetan teacher who had gone off the rails some years ago. I actually had read a fair bit about it, but I never mentioned anything to her - it's all widely available and I am no judge of anyone else's practice. Instead a positive support is more useful I think...
_/|\_
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Cittasanto
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by Cittasanto »

mirco wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:
mirco wrote:
I see nothing in this that is unique.
Good for you :-)
why good for me?
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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badscooter
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by badscooter »

As stated earlier in this thread,if Vimalaramsi's technique works for you, then by all means use it.. I was just pointing out that his outlandish remarks of other teachers, ideas, and techniques (and his nonfactual story of Buddhaghosa) are unintellectual, untrue, and unwarranted... He could have simply stated that this was his way of interpreting the suttas and that this technique works for him and left it at that.. Instead he tried to bad mouth very respected monks and teachers and make an unsuccessful attempt to downgrade and belittle others' practices and beliefs. Doing so without a shred of evidence on top of it.. Monks are not supposed to spread false truths (especially of other good monastics), I find that this is hard for him to follow.


may all be well
"whatever one frequently thinks and ponders upon will be the inclination of one's mind"
dhammarelax
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by dhammarelax »

Khalil Bodhi wrote:Hi All,

I have heard some criticisms of late of Bhante Vimalaramsi and would be interested in hearing why some people have an issue or issues with him. I haven't heard him personally attack any other teachers so would appreciate links to the same if possible. In addition, his techniques seem sound to me but I may be wrong. I ask because I have been experimenting with his teachings so I am personally invested in knowing all there is to know about him as a teacher. Metta.

Mike
Hi Mike

I saw your post and although is being a while since you wrote it I think is worth answering it, me as many have been on the path for many years, some things I experienced along with some teachers are very good but as far as I have seen there is nothing out there that compares to the results that Bhante Vimalaramsis method renders, practicing one day following his advise (Brahmaviharas) I experienced all the jhanas and the cessation of feeling and perception, on one day of practice I had more progress than in my about ten year meditation practice, now I think that says it all.

With metta
Dhammarelax
Even if the flesh & blood in my body dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, I will use all my human firmness, human persistence and human striving. There will be no relaxing my persistence until I am the first of my generation to attain full awakening in this lifetime. ed. AN 2.5
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tiltbillings
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by tiltbillings »

dhammarelax wrote:
Khalil Bodhi wrote:Hi All,

I have heard some criticisms of late of Bhante Vimalaramsi and would be interested in hearing why some people have an issue or issues with him. I haven't heard him personally attack any other teachers so would appreciate links to the same if possible. In addition, his techniques seem sound to me but I may be wrong. I ask because I have been experimenting with his teachings so I am personally invested in knowing all there is to know about him as a teacher. Metta.

Mike
Hi Mike

I saw your post and although is being a while since you wrote it I think is worth answering it, me as many have been on the path for many years, some things I experienced along with some teachers are very good but as far as I have seen there is nothing out there that compares to the results that Bhante Vimalaramsis method renders, practicing one day following his advise (Brahmaviharas) I experienced all the jhanas and the cessation of feeling and perception, on one day of practice I had more progress than in my about ten year meditation practice, now I think that says it all.

With metta
Dhammarelax
And Vimalaramsi verified this?
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
dhammarelax
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by dhammarelax »

Hi tiltbillings

I have never spoken to Bhante Vimalaramsi but I think that I can correctly assert that the attainment is such because after some time I had again the experience of cessation of perception and feeling and this time I experienced the fruition as well, now what follows the fruition is really something that can not be mistaken, is a very happy feeling that lasts for a long period of time we are talking a few days or so and after that there is a real personality change. The hindrances still arise but they will not take control so easily they are much more manageable and I became much more calmed.

I say that what follows the fruition cannot be mistaken comparing it with the path attainment that is seeing the links of dependent origination, this links present themselves as blinks of light that can be easily mistaken for something else or for something without importance.

with metta
dhammarelax
Even if the flesh & blood in my body dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, I will use all my human firmness, human persistence and human striving. There will be no relaxing my persistence until I am the first of my generation to attain full awakening in this lifetime. ed. AN 2.5
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tiltbillings
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by tiltbillings »

dhammarelax wrote:Hi tiltbillings

I have never spoken to Bhante Vimalaramsi but I think that I can correctly assert that the attainment is such because after some time I had again the experience of cessation of perception and feeling and this time I experienced the fruition as well, now what follows the fruition is really something that can not be mistaken, is a very happy feeling that lasts for a long period of time we are talking a few days or so and after that there is a real personality change. The hindrances still arise but they will not take control so easily they are much more manageable and I became much more calmed.

I say that what follows the fruition cannot be mistaken comparing it with the path attainment that is seeing the links of dependent origination, this links present themselves as blinks of light that can be easily mistaken for something else or for something without importance.

with metta
dhammarelax
No doubt you attainted something.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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Dhammanando
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by Dhammanando »

dhammarelax wrote:I say that what follows the fruition cannot be mistaken comparing it with the path attainment that is seeing the links of dependent origination, this links present themselves as blinks of light that can be easily mistaken for something else or for something without importance.
The links of dependent origination appear as blinks of light? Do you mean literally blinks of light, or do you mean that they resemble blinks of light in certain respects?
Yena yena hi maññanti,
tato taṃ hoti aññathā.


In whatever way they conceive it,
It turns out otherwise.
(Sn. 588)
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tiltbillings
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by tiltbillings »

The question of the Buddha making mistakes has been moved here: http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=22342
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
dhammarelax
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by dhammarelax »

Dhammanando wrote:
dhammarelax wrote:I say that what follows the fruition cannot be mistaken comparing it with the path attainment that is seeing the links of dependent origination, this links present themselves as blinks of light that can be easily mistaken for something else or for something without importance.
The links of dependent origination appear as blinks of light? Do you mean literally blinks of light, or do you mean that they resemble blinks of light in certain respects?
In this case (after cessation) which is lets call it their purest form they are seen as blinks of light which I think means that literally appear as such but it doesn't mean that they are only blinks of light, they are still the links and when one of them is released you can see a strong effect, they happen fast and they happen once or more times, they are small blinks not big flashings. I had some instances in daily life that while observing the partial (not the full series) arising of dependent origination I perceived them as blinks of light without the experience of cessation coming before, in this case however the latest links eg clinging do not appear as light but for clinging as thought.

This is not the way they appear when observed in reverse order (without cessation) which is by far the practice that takes most of the practice time (four noble truths), in reverse order they appear as described eg feeling is painful pleasant or neutral.

with metta
dhammarelax
Even if the flesh & blood in my body dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, I will use all my human firmness, human persistence and human striving. There will be no relaxing my persistence until I am the first of my generation to attain full awakening in this lifetime. ed. AN 2.5
Paganpants
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by Paganpants »

Different Meditation practices work for different people at different times, that's why the Buddha taught so many different methods. The criticism arises from attachment to views, as the Buddha taught, this is the strongest attachment. The Buddha even gave contradictory teachings because the teaching is designed to break attachments specific to those audiences being taught, but the core of his teachings are always the same. When I succeed in meditation, there is nothing to say, and nowhere to go. Right view is no view. All is relative, arising and passing away dependent on causes and conditions, attachment is identification with these momentary holograms. Let go of views, watch the dhammas do what they do. Right view is an attitude of calm detachment. This is the first of the noble path for a reason. So I don't understand how so much debate exists in the sanga. Right now as you read this comment, what views arise? These views arise resulting from attachment to contrary views you like. If you HOLD any views, you will suffer. Views are relative, impermanent, and impersonal like all other conditioned things. Views arise and pass away like the sound of a bell or the sounds in your space right now, but you don't try to HOLD those sounds. This is meditation in all postures, mental and physical. In short, practice the path, forget the views, they are all wrong. Peace
SarathW
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Re: Bhante Vimalaramsi

Post by SarathW »

Technically right view is not a no view.
Right view is a view but it is called right because it benefits to the goal.
:)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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