More faulty Buddhist thinking?

A place to discuss casual topics amongst spiritual friends.
Spiny Norman
Posts: 10157
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:32 am
Location: Andromeda looks nice

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by Spiny Norman »

Goofaholix wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:He was criticising the Buddhist belief that the physical world is only in the mind, and arguing that if you get run over by a bus it will still kill you.

I can see that "bus" is a mental construct, but I also believe there are large noisy things with wheels "out there" which I need to avoid when crossing the road.

Does that make me a bad Buddhist, or is his criticism actually a :strawman: ? ;)
If that's the case he's criticising Mahayana, Theravada doesn't have such a belief.
That's what I found confusing, he seemed to be criticising the Yogacara view, but using quotes from a Theravada monk... :shrug:
Buddha save me from new-agers!
User avatar
tiltbillings
Posts: 23046
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:25 am

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by tiltbillings »

Spiny Norman wrote:
Goofaholix wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:He was criticising the Buddhist belief that the physical world is only in the mind, and arguing that if you get run over by a bus it will still kill you.

I can see that "bus" is a mental construct, but I also believe there are large noisy things with wheels "out there" which I need to avoid when crossing the road.

Does that make me a bad Buddhist, or is his criticism actually a :strawman: ? ;)
If that's the case he's criticising Mahayana, Theravada doesn't have such a belief.
That's what I found confusing, he seemed to be criticising the Yogacara view, but using quotes from a Theravada monk... :shrug:
Actually, that is a caricature of Yogācāra, which is actually used by the Tibetan tenet system, but a more accurate picture of Yogācāra can be found in this essay:

What is and isn't Yogācāra
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
User avatar
Goofaholix
Posts: 4017
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:49 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by Goofaholix »

Spiny Norman wrote:That's what I found confusing, he seemed to be criticising the Yogacara view, but using quotes from a Theravada monk... :shrug:
I thought there might be some interesting points or intellectual debate, I was dissappointed. Having had a chance to watch the video he's fixating on a couple of quotes from a monk taken out of context and there is no evidence they were intended the way he interpreted them.

I think the video can be summarised in his own words...
"This highlights one of the biggest problems of people everywhere, the problem of speaking unnecessarily about things you know nothing about".
Pronouns (no self / not self)
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
User avatar
tiltbillings
Posts: 23046
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:25 am

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by tiltbillings »

Goofaholix wrote:
I think the video can be summarised in his own words...
"This highlights one of the biggest problems of people everywhere, the problem of speaking unnecessarily about things you know nothing about".
Or a little bit of information can be a dangerous thing, as we see played out here from time to time.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
User avatar
Dan74
Posts: 4529
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:12 pm
Location: Switzerland

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by Dan74 »

tiltbillings wrote:
Goofaholix wrote:
I think the video can be summarised in his own words...
"This highlights one of the biggest problems of people everywhere, the problem of speaking unnecessarily about things you know nothing about".
Or a little bit of information can be a dangerous thing, as we see played out here from time to time.
:twothumbsup: to both of you.
_/|\_
chownah
Posts: 9336
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by chownah »

Spiny Norman wrote:
Goofaholix wrote:
Spiny Norman wrote:He was criticising the Buddhist belief that the physical world is only in the mind, and arguing that if you get run over by a bus it will still kill you.

I can see that "bus" is a mental construct, but I also believe there are large noisy things with wheels "out there" which I need to avoid when crossing the road.

Does that make me a bad Buddhist, or is his criticism actually a :strawman: ? ;)
If that's the case he's criticising Mahayana, Theravada doesn't have such a belief.
That's what I found confusing, he seemed to be criticising the Yogacara view, but using quotes from a Theravada monk... :shrug:
I think there is no need for confusion. He says that buddhist beliefs and the teachings of the buddha are two entirely seperate things and it is the beliefs of buddhists that he is addressing. There are theravada buddhists who ascribe to (for instance) the idea that the world is mind made which he interprets as meaning that the world is "a figment of the imagination.".....and I think he is correct that there are buddhists who think this and given his interpretation of what this means (a figment etc.) then he presents a scenario which he feels discredits the "figment" idea and thus also discredits the "world as mind made" idea. Of course he is actually jousting with his own illinformed notions and in this example it is not even clear to me that the excerpt of the monk actually applies to this example....but....anyway....that seems to be what he is up to in general. I really don't think this rises to the level of him portraying any particular style or school of thought or any school of buddhism (although I could be wrong)....it is just him trying to debunk some ideas which to him seem to be untenable. From the little bit I watched (not all of it) I don't think he is doing an especially good job of it although I do agree in that alot of the ideas of alot of buddhists seem pretty wacky to me too.
chownah
Caodemarte
Posts: 1092
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 3:21 pm

Re: More faulty Buddhist thinking?

Post by Caodemarte »

Mahayana rejects such views as well. It is just a straw man.
Post Reply