Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

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Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby alan » Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:41 pm

Hi friends.
The government is not trying to take over your home. The brown people aren't all criminals. And the gays sometimes are decent people, too. Real Buddhists have more important things to think about, and certainly don't obsess on petty hatreds.
Right?
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby Aloka » Fri Jun 28, 2013 2:56 pm

alan wrote:Hi friends.
The government is not trying to take over your home. The brown people aren't all criminals. And the gays sometimes are decent people, too. Real Buddhists have more important things to think about, and certainly don't obsess on petty hatreds.
Right?


Hi alan,

I don't live in the USA so I'm not quite sure what you're talking about. Can you also explain what you mean by "real Buddhists" please ?

With metta,

Aloka
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby alan » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:02 pm

I'm referring to a recently closed thread, in which some long-term practitioners expressed opinions which seemed quite nutty.
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby Aloka » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:29 pm

alan wrote:I'm referring to a recently closed thread, in which some long-term practitioners expressed opinions which seemed quite nutty.


Oh ok, I didn't see it, sorry.
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby Vern Stevens » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:37 pm

alan wrote: Real Buddhists have more important things to think about, and certainly don't obsess on petty hatreds.
Right?


Hmm, perhaps I would have reading one of those more important things if I hadn't clicked on this thread. Who determines what "Real Buddhists" are?
“What we think, we become.“ - The Buddha
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby alan » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:57 pm

Not a who, a what. People who obsess on petty things are not real Buddhists. Isn't that obvious?
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby binocular » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:58 pm

Vern Stevens wrote:Who determines what "Real Buddhists" are?

The High Council of Real Buddhism. Only the spectacularly advanced get the one-in-a-million-kalpas chance to be evaluated and considered for beginner membership. All others can just go to hell.

:woohoo:
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby binocular » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:59 pm

alan wrote:Not a who, a what. People who obsess on petty things are not real Buddhists. Isn't that obvious?

Ah, when you point a finger at others, four fingers keep pointing back at you.
:cry:
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby alan » Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:01 pm

Which means what?
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby kirk5a » Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:30 pm

binocular wrote:Ah, when you point a finger at others, four fingers keep pointing back at you.
:cry:

I can't get my thumb to point backwards.
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby binocular » Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:52 pm

Lol. Is it opposable?
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby kirk5a » Fri Jun 28, 2013 5:04 pm

binocular wrote:Lol. Is it opposable?

Yes, fortunately. Just not double jointed. :smile:
"When one thing is practiced & pursued, ignorance is abandoned, clear knowing arises, the conceit 'I am' is abandoned, latent tendencies are uprooted, fetters are abandoned. Which one thing? Mindfulness immersed in the body." -AN 1.230
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby David N. Snyder » Fri Jun 28, 2013 5:44 pm

alan wrote:The government is not trying to take over your home. The brown people aren't all criminals. And the gays sometimes are decent people, too. Real Buddhists have more important things to think about, and certainly don't obsess on petty hatreds.
Right?


I'm not a big fan of conspiracy theories either, but aren't you conflating some things here? Of course brown people are not criminals, gays are decent, but those who are concerned about big government do not necessarily believe in the other things you mentioned.

The government does sometimes take over people's houses; it is allowed under eminent domain rules. I don't expect it to happen, but the Constitution even allows soldiers to take up residence in virtually any home, including your home, if necessary. And the government does sometimes have corruption and I don't think you would disagree with that.
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby lyndon taylor » Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:01 pm

Vern Stevens wrote:
alan wrote: Real Buddhists have more important things to think about, and certainly don't obsess on petty hatreds.
Right?


Hmm, perhaps I would have reading one of those more important things if I hadn't clicked on this thread. Who determines what "Real Buddhists" are?


I think one of the inferences is that "real Buddhists" don't have any problem with government surveillance of all their phone calls and emails, not to mention forum postings......
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk. I am not a scholar, great meditator, or authority on Buddhism, but Buddhism is something I love from the Bottom of my heart. It has taught me sobriety, morality, peace, and very importantly that my suffering is optional, and doesn't have to run my life. I hope to give back what little I can to the Buddhist community that has so generously given me so much, sincerely former monk John
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby Vern Stevens » Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:05 pm

alan wrote: People who obsess on petty things are not real Buddhists. Isn't that obvious?


What is obvious is that many, many "Real Buddhists" come with all sorts of problems, imperfections and fetters they have to overcome. Many of them also come with big egos and are often judgmental of other people, something which is a very non-Buddhist activity. "Real Buddhists" endeavor to practice compassion, even for those with whom they disagree, rather than call their ideas "nutty" or threaten to physically assault them by spanking them because they don't like their attitude. I've seen that on this board and rather than thinking that person was malicious and "not a Real Buddhist", I thought, this person must be suffering, like all the rest of us, and he/she is resorting to unskilled behavior as a result.

It would be nice to see members of a "Sangha" be supportive of the suffering and trials of the other members, not judgmental and deriding of them.

Edit: I realize I'm assuming that a forum board of people with similar interests is a very loose "sangha", or perhaps better termed a community.
“What we think, we become.“ - The Buddha
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby m0rl0ck » Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:19 pm

alan wrote:Hi friends.
The government is not trying to take over your home.


I have watch government control of citizens lives increase since the 70's. The final straw was the patriot act, which pretty much strips US citizens of any right of privacy or guarantee of of due process. Do you live in the US?

Whatever Snowdens faults may be, he has by circumstance been cast as a defender of the US Consitution.
"When you meditate, don't send your mind outside. Don't fasten onto any knowledge at all. Whatever knowledge you've gained from books or teachers, don't bring it in to complicate things. Cut away all preoccupations, and then as you meditate let all your knowledge come from what's going on in the mind. When the mind is quiet, you'll know it for yourself. But you have to keep meditating a lot. When the time comes for things to develop, they'll develop on their own. Whatever you know, have it come from your own mind.
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:31 pm

alan wrote:Hi friends.
The government is not trying to take over your home. The brown people aren't all criminals. And the gays sometimes are decent people, too. Real Buddhists have more important things to think about, and certainly don't obsess on petty hatreds.
Right?
"Real Buddhists" like everyone else have to deal with their peculiarities.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby manas » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:13 pm

m0rl0ck wrote:
alan wrote:Hi friends.
The government is not trying to take over your home.


I have watch government control of citizens lives increase since the 70's. The final straw was the patriot act, which pretty much strips US citizens of any right of privacy or guarantee of of due process. Do you live in the US?

Whatever Snowdens faults may be, he has by circumstance been cast as a defender of the US Consitution.

:goodpost:

Well said Morlock, that was the main point I was trying to make in a recent topic (now locked). Snowden is not perfect, but he has done one good important action - revealed the extent of Government surveillance of even innocent civilians. Someone had to do it, and it happened to be Snowden. A question: so do the People just roll over and accept that they should no longer expect any privacy whatsoever in their communications, or do they demand that their elected representatives - which is what Government is supposed to be - wind back this abhorrent and unconstitutional infringement of basic human rights?

It will be interesting to see if there is enough of a groundswell of resolve to see the right of ordinary persons who are not suspected of any crime, to not have phone conversations, emails and other communications listened to, recorded etc by the Govt. Unless there is a valid suspicion of a crime, and a properly obtained warrant, there is no justification for it!

kind regards
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby Dan74 » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:27 pm

Regarding that other thread, I have talked to people and thought more about it, and I am not sure this is such a good thing (Prism, I mean).

I mean for the government to have access to all this communication and have no judicial oversight is fraught with danger. Would Watergate have come out? Would Irangate have come out, if the government had access to all the communications, could easily find out journalists' informers? And so much more. You might want to have a look at this report from The Young Turks:



So we should be careful not to be too quick to label people conspiracy nuts. On the other hand, when this stuff goes on and the mainstream media is controlled by special interests, many people go overboard and fall into conspiratorial mindsets...
_/|\_
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Re: Conspiracy nuts, gay marriage, and immigration.

Postby EmptyShadow » Sat Jun 29, 2013 3:51 am

I guess a "real buddhist" would let go when other people don't share his opinion about the US government and woudn't call them 'conspiracy nuts' only because he doesn't agree with them :smile:
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